Ai haibara episodes

Forum reserved for discussing specific points of the story—mostly from the manga. Be warned, these discussions will be current with the manga and will spoil many plot lines for anime-centric fans.
Kor
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Re: Ai haibara episodes

Post by Kor »

Chekhov MacGuffin wrote:
Khinkhun wrote: We still have a lot of things to know about her... I mean yeah she develops drugs, but what for? and since she's in the organization, how come she never told Conan's the Organization name? and How much does she really know?
She probably knows a lot of "inner secrets." She uses the phrase (more than once I think), "the people you (Conan) call the men in black," which implies she knows another name for them, probably the syndicate's true name, but does not wish to tell Conan. (I can't find the sources for the quote)
As for why, the obvious reason is that Aoyama Gosho doesn't want her to be a massive story breaker by spilling the org's inner secrets all at once. The in-universe reason would probably be because she is trying to "protect" Conan somehow. She might hope he will give up before he goes in too deep. Ai could also be afraid that Conan will hate her if he finds out the truth of her role in the org. Maybe she doesn't trust him with the secrets or thinks he is unready to face the org. She could also be deeply brainwashed for loyalty and therefore she is uncomfortable talking about the syndicate. Or perhaps she doesn't want to feel responsible if Conan acts on information she gives him and winds up dying, since she will somehow feel it is her fault.
Whatever her reasons are, they aren't sensible now. Initially it was more logical because she didn't know Conan that well and her character hadn't opened up enough. Currently, her reasons are nonsensical or at least irrational because her character and her relationship with Conan have developed considerably. It's obvious Conan isn't going to give up despite the risk and will only commit himself further each step he takes. As for not trusting Conan... she strikes me as a mediocre judge of personality, but Conan is so forthright with his general good intentions it would seem impossible to misjudge. Maybe her current reason is primarily irrational, governed by fears of losing someone. Another reason might be that she wants to see how well Conan can do with minimal guidance since he is good at catching on. (I sure hope not, because that would be irritating.)
Her character has always bothered me because I feel like the strings Gosho uses to make her dance to plot are more visible than those of the other characters.
Gosho does that because he doesn't intend to finish the manga yet, at least that's the way it seems to me. I know too that there is no reason for Haibara to not tell Conan everything. But then again, Gosho always left too much things unsolved in the past no matter how insignificant they may have truly were.
The thing that Haibara's mom told her in the tapes.
In the case when Araide returns Conan tried to figure out something about Vermouth and he said "damn, now I have another mystery to solve" which he didn't solve and to me it seems like Gosho forgot all about it.
Every once in a while (at least before episode 345) Haibara thought something mysterious like she was hiding something, but now we don't get more clues, like either Gosho forgot, or he doesn't have more clues.

Conan must know that Haibara still hides things. and I've come with a good way for him to make her talk

Conan calls Jodie sensei
Conan: Jodie, I found a way to reveal the true identity of the organization and who the boss is, *he pauses dramatically* but I need your help...


Later in Agasa's house. Agasa is out and suddenly Conan and Jodie enter and Haibara looked surprised.
Haibara: What are you doing here?
Conan: Haibara, it is time for you to talk...
Haibara: about what?
Conan: About the organization.
Haibara: I already told you everything I know
Jodie comes from behind and holds Haibara and Conan pulls out a feather
Conan: Then I guess that..........I have no choice.
He starts to tickle her with the feather until she reveals all of her secrets.


Jodie sensei doesn't really know  what's with Haibara and the organization so it can't really work. But still...the thought is amusing.
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Re: Ai haibara episodes

Post by AICHAN »

Kor wrote:
Chekhov MacGuffin wrote:
Khinkhun wrote: We still have a lot of things to know about her... I mean yeah she develops drugs, but what for? and since she's in the organization, how come she never told Conan's the Organization name? and How much does she really know?
She probably knows a lot of "inner secrets." She uses the phrase (more than once I think), "the people you (Conan) call the men in black," which implies she knows another name for them, probably the syndicate's true name, but does not wish to tell Conan. (I can't find the sources for the quote)
As for why, the obvious reason is that Aoyama Gosho doesn't want her to be a massive story breaker by spilling the org's inner secrets all at once. The in-universe reason would probably be because she is trying to "protect" Conan somehow. She might hope he will give up before he goes in too deep. Ai could also be afraid that Conan will hate her if he finds out the truth of her role in the org. Maybe she doesn't trust him with the secrets or thinks he is unready to face the org. She could also be deeply brainwashed for loyalty and therefore she is uncomfortable talking about the syndicate. Or perhaps she doesn't want to feel responsible if Conan acts on information she gives him and winds up dying, since she will somehow feel it is her fault.
Whatever her reasons are, they aren't sensible now. Initially it was more logical because she didn't know Conan that well and her character hadn't opened up enough. Currently, her reasons are nonsensical or at least irrational because her character and her relationship with Conan have developed considerably. It's obvious Conan isn't going to give up despite the risk and will only commit himself further each step he takes. As for not trusting Conan... she strikes me as a mediocre judge of personality, but Conan is so forthright with his general good intentions it would seem impossible to misjudge. Maybe her current reason is primarily irrational, governed by fears of losing someone. Another reason might be that she wants to see how well Conan can do with minimal guidance since he is good at catching on. (I sure hope not, because that would be irritating.)
Her character has always bothered me because I feel like the strings Gosho uses to make her dance to plot are more visible than those of the other characters.
Gosho does that because he doesn't intend to finish the manga yet, at least that's the way it seems to me. I know too that there is no reason for Haibara to not tell Conan everything. But then again, Gosho always left too much things unsolved in the past no matter how insignificant they may have truly were.
The thing that Haibara's mom told her in the tapes.
In the case when Araide returns Conan tried to figure out something about Vermouth and he said "damn, now I have another mystery to solve" which he didn't solve and to me it seems like Gosho forgot all about it.
Every once in a while (at least before episode 345) Haibara thought something mysterious like she was hiding something, but now we don't get more clues, like either Gosho forgot, or he doesn't have more clues.

Conan must know that Haibara still hides things. and I've come with a good way for him to make her talk

Conan calls Jodie sensei
Conan: Jodie, I found a way to reveal the true identity of the organization and who the boss is, *he pauses dramatically* but I need your help...


Later in Agasa's house. Agasa is out and suddenly Conan and Jodie enter and Haibara looked surprised.
Haibara: What are you doing here?
Conan: Haibara, it is time for you to talk...
Haibara: about what?
Conan: About the organization.
Haibara: I already told you everything I know
Jodie comes from behind and holds Haibara and Conan pulls out a feather
Conan: Then I guess that..........I have no choice.
He starts to tickle her with the feather until she reveals all of her secrets.


Jodie sensei doesn't really know  what's with Haibara and the organization so it can't really work. But still...the thought is amusing.
LOL!it would be so  funny  ;D XDXD
Her character has always bothered me because I feel like the strings Gosho uses to make her dance to plot are more visible than those of the other characters.
 
hmm,what do you mean ?i don't understand ???
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Re: Ai haibara episodes

Post by Eve »

AICHAN wrote:
Her character has always bothered me because I feel like the strings Gosho uses to make her dance to plot are more visible than those of the other characters.
 
hmm,what do you mean ?i don't understand ???
Huh?
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Re: Ai haibara episodes

Post by AICHAN »

Khinkhun wrote:
AICHAN wrote:
Her character has always bothered me because I feel like the strings Gosho uses to make her dance to plot are more visible than those of the other characters.
 
hmm,what do you mean ?i don't understand ???
Huh?
LOL^^ i don't know if you're replying to me, but i just want to have more explanation about  that sentence , i wanted  Chekov Macguffin to develop this point^^
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Re: Ai haibara episodes

Post by Eve »

AICHAN wrote:
Khinkhun wrote:
AICHAN wrote:
Her character has always bothered me because I feel like the strings Gosho uses to make her dance to plot are more visible than those of the other characters.
 
hmm,what do you mean ?i don't understand ???
Huh?
LOL^^ i don't know if you're replying to me, but i just want to have more explanation about  that sentence , i wanted  Chekov Macguffin to develop this point^^
Yeah I think I want him to explain her standpoint also ^_^
Last edited by Anonymous on September 10th, 2009, 9:41 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Ai haibara episodes

Post by Chekhov MacGuffin »

Khinkhun wrote: Yeah I think I want him to explain his standpoint also ^_^
Chekhov MacGuffin wrote: Her character has always bothered me because I feel like the strings Gosho uses to make her dance to plot are more visible than those of the other characters.
In the best fiction, you do not notice that the author is controlling a character's actions towards a certain end because the character's actions are consistent with their personality and their past behavior. Likewise, a good puppeteer draws your entire focus to the puppets so that you completely forget about the strings the puppet is being manipulated with. A problem occurs when there is a contradiction between the author's need to maintain the plot and the readers' expectations of the character's behavior. Haibara has developed into an awkward character because currently there does not seem to be a good reason for the discrepancy between her intent (keep her friends from being killed while they destroy an evil organization) and her actions (give out as little useful information as possible to said friends). The result is loss of the reader's willing suspension of disbelief; Haibara's "strings" become noticeable.
The problem isn't very serious; Haibara is an otherwise pretty well-thought-out character. It's just significant enough to bother me and unfortunately it makes me like her less than I should. (I'm NOT saying I don't like Haibara, so Ai fans don't flame me please!)
Last edited by Chekhov MacGuffin on April 21st, 2010, 12:29 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Ai haibara episodes

Post by Abs. »

It may be that we don't know enough about Haibara's motivations, and that would explain why she does things that seemingly don't make sense, i.e. not revealing everything about the organization.  You're right, C. MacG, that Aoyama-sensei didn't want everything about the organization to be revealed with the introduction of her character, but as a storyteller, you don't introduce a character like that without giving them a good reason NOT to tell all.

When her character is first introduced, we can assume that the reason is because she doesn't know where she stands with Conan and Agasa.  However, as the story progresses, it would seem that she isn't as interested in bringing the organization down as much as she just wants to stop being pursued and enjoy living a normal life.  At the same time, she is intent on getting her hands on the Apotoxin and continuing her research on it.  While it appears that she is doing so to try to find an antidote, it can also be assumed that she just wants to continue developing the drug as it was originally intended.

I think Haibara needs the organization to still exist so that she can still have access to the information regarding Apotoxin-4869.. however, there may be another, personal, reason behind why she doesn't want Conan to know too much about the organization, which Aoyama-sensei seems to hint at here and there.

Also, if you think about it, Jodie knew that Haibara knew the secret behind Vermouth not appearing to age, and Jodie had her suspicious about Conan's and Haibara's appearances as well.  Yet, we never see Jodie ask Haibara about that, or about the organization - we only see Jodie trying to convince Haibara to join the Witness Protection Program.  That, to me, is more inexplicable than Haibara never telling.

(The discussion in this thread seems to have gone WAY off course somewhere...)
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Re: Ai haibara episodes

Post by KaitoKid0 »

sstimson wrote:
KaitoKid0 wrote:
Hey, I was just wondering if you guys can tell me all of the episodes Ai appears in, Big or small roles doesn't matter

Thank You Very Much
Question? Does that include Openings and Endings because if so then everyone since 129 would be included
technically no...and how did this become more than 2 pages ? lol
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Re: Ai haibara episodes

Post by Chekhov MacGuffin »

KaitoKid0 wrote: technically no...and how did this become more than 2 pages ? lol
I think I am partially responsible. Sorry.
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Re: Ai haibara episodes

Post by Eve »

why am I reviving this? because my Xternal HD totally bunked out about a month ago and my effort to recover all the lost files were lost so there, I need to this to reminds me of all the important episodes XD
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Re: Ai haibara episodes

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