Discussion thread: Detective Conan 987-989

[ShadowNeo]

Hm to me this looks like a piece of a necklace maybe, and the little thing on the bottom is maybe the whole where you put the string... but I wouldn't know what kind of necklace it would be or what meaning it would have.

[Tantei San]

Dunno about you, but do you see the little "piece" at the bottom right?
No idea what that is.

First I was sure about the Shogi-tile , first association too, but now...

Even I was gonna point out, that bulge at the end makes it look like neither a shogi piece nor a mirror piece.

[Random Reader]

I'm just taking a wild stab here but could it be something like a locket or a shogi keychain? The thing couldn't be big since it fits in the back pocket and wouldn't be as weird as say, a piece of broken mirror when you carry it around.

[dccd]

Exactly my thought too.
I put my money on a shogi-keychain.

Maybe even a gift from Kohji himself to Rumi?

[MCAL]

I wonder if this two week break signifies the next case will be more than three chapters.

[Tantei San]

It will hardly go that far, maybe gosho is setting up the 1000th file and for that purpose it will take 2 weeks.

[Themaninarmor]

Ran : Conan, staring woman's butt is rude.. Don't be like my father.

okay seriously.. i don't know if it is clue or not.... but normally people tend to use the side pocket for keeping a small thing.. right?

EDIT : So.. Ai already have same idea with me.

[Kor]

A word of caution. Gosho can't be consistent about Akai's phone, and between the glimpse of the flashback and the actual flashback (a span of a few weeks) Gosho made a lot of errors, and he even forgot to include Ran in that moment Masumi asks Shinichi if he's a wizard even though it was previously established she's supposed to be there to hear it.

Point is, I wouldn't advise to get too pedantic about the shape of that object (to the extreme detail) cause it may end up not having the very same exact shape once it's revealed. Gosho isn't as superbly careful about details as some people may think he is.

[Kudo Shinchi]

A word of caution. Gosho can't be consistent about Akai's phone, and between the glimpse of the flashback and the actual flashback (a span of a few weeks) Gosho made a lot of errors, and he even forgot to include Ran in that moment Masumi asks Shinichi if he's a wizard even though it was previously established she's supposed to be there to hear it.

Point is, I wouldn't advise to get too pedantic about the shape of that object (to the extreme detail) cause it may end up not having the very same exact shape once it's revealed. Gosho isn't as superbly careful about details as some people may think he is.

He is when it matters. A few recent minor errors don't outweigh the literal decades of careful detail he's displayed in his mysteries (and when he feels he made an error in something important, he goes back and fixes it, as when he adjusted the position of Kir's pinky on Conan's neck back in her introductory case for the volume release). Of course, if whatever's in Rumi's pocket isn't all that important in the larger scheme of things, probably he can be a little flexible in what the actual shape is. But I wouldn't immediately dismiss being pedantic about it.

[Swagnarok]

It's also possible that at this point Gosho doesn't even know what's in Rumi's pocket, in which case its final shape and characteristics could not be determined from what was shown in the recent case.

[MeiTanteixX]

he even forgot to include Ran in that moment Masumi asks Shinichi if he's a wizard even though it was previously established she's supposed to be there to hear it.

Do you seriously think he isn't gonna follow this up from Ran's perspective?

[caribou]

Some thoughts on the file...

Spoiler:

I agree with the theory that Rumi is probably the missing bodyguard.

Conan and Haibara seemed to be particularly struck with how "frozen still" the murderer was when Rumi spoke to him, which suggests that it was something more than typical fear... I thought it meant that Rumi might be familiar with some special combat/police tactics to deal with this sort of "hostage" situation. That scene in the file was vaguely reminiscent of how Conan noticed the way Kir placed her hand on his head and another little boy's head which hinted at her being CIA-trained.

I also agree with the theory that Haibara may know/recognise something about Rumi in a similar way Conan knew something about Okiya. That implicit trust just seems too similar. To me it sounded like Haibara was asking Conan not to ask any more questions and blow Rumi's cover.

The whole file suggests to me that Rumi is someone who was close to Kohji, who mistrusts the police for being unable to identify his killer (and who the police has some tension with -- hence Kuroda's comment at the start of the file sarcastically asking if it is okay with her to contact the authorities). The problem with this line of thought is that it is inconsistent with Rumi also being the missing bodyguard, since if the police know her then they should know that she is the missing bodyguard (?) and in any case if she wants the investigation to progress then she should come forward and identify herself as a witness. Maybe the tension between her and the police is because Kuroda DOES know her as the missing bodyguard and therefore prime suspect, but has insufficient evidence to charge or arrest her, and she is upset because she wants to clear her name?

All in all I still have a lot of question marks but those are my thoughts at the moment!

As for the item in Rumi's pocket, the shogi keychain seems the most plausible idea suggested so far...

[Unlucky Devil]

Spoiler:

Haibara is not one to place trust in other people too quickly. The way she quickly went from noticing Rumi's inability to see from one of her eyes to trusting and even defending her makes me wonder if seeing certain of her actions reminded her of someone that she knows. It may be that she recognised who it was or that her actions were similar to someone that she looked up to (only her sister and parents come to my mind). As far as who it could be that she may have recognised, I cannot guess.
Although I doubt Rumi = Vermouth, there surely are certain characteristics that are similar - her ability to sense when something bad may be about to happen (Golden Apple Case - Sharon said that). Sherry's dialogue of liking her makes it unlikely that it is the case, because she is terrified of Vermouth. Also, Vermouth was portrayed to be good at heart (Dr. Ariade), but when it came to Rumi, she is being portrayed as a bad person so far...I really dunno what to make of it. Guess Chapter 1000 onwards, we're gonna get some light shed on this matter.

[Absenta]

As MeiTanteiXX stated in the RUM arc post it is very possible that Rumi was Kohji´s bodyguard and at the same time, had a sentimental relationship with him. Amanda couldn´t rely in BO, either FBI or CIA (it is very possible that RUM could be infiltrated in CIA or FBI , makes sense because normally is the good side that have people infiltrated in the BO.

It is very possible that Amanda had a delicate chat in his room about what´s going on (Rum, a terrible member of the BO is infiltrated in the FBI and CIA), she believed that Kohji as a very intelligent guy and she asked for help, Kohji probably thought that Amanda was a paranoical old lady but just for her tranquility he let her his bodyguard (Asaca-Rumi). After all, a Shogi player is not a political figure or something great.


The FBI or CIA (therefore, RUM) could have put on her a transmitter and hear the conversation.

After this...my theory is not completely clear, but I have my own assumptions...:


Rum then prepares a quick plan in which he disguises as ASACA. Amanda shows her gratefullness to ASACA giving her a hand mirror. Possibly because Amanda sees her as a manly bodyguard buy with a feminine side. After that Amanda prepares herself to go to bed and ASACA guards her room. (That´s probably when Gaito Hotta sees her with the mirror). ASACA kills Amanda leaving no trace and then goes after Haneda.

ASACA(Rum) enters the room and soon Kohji notices that something is wrong, they have a struggle fight. Kohji uses the scissors and hits RUM in one of his eyes,removing his mask and splitting blood. Rum wounds Kohji and finally makes him ingest the drug. Then, Rum uses the glass trick to incriminate ASACA (removing probably ASCAAA) while hearing someone is coming he tries to flee.
I don´t believe that Kohji could left that dying message, we saw how Shinichi or Shiho suffered from the effects , that doesn´t give you enough strenght to smash the mirror and all the stuff. (that just could be possible if someone was present too in the room, and even before Kohji takes the drug).

That is the the real ASACA and it´s probable that she knew something about RUM before she bodyguarded Amanda, and it´s probable that she found out that she was dead and then went to talk to Kohji. When she arrives in the room she finds Kohji dead and really a mess, along the hand mirror with a dying message ( ASACA) , knowing that this would incriminate her, she removes U and all the test of words to change the dying message to ASACA RUM, leading to the conclusion that was Rum who killed Kohji and Amanda. She algo takes photos of the crime scene (but I don´t know why she would have a camera) before the police arrive.

The fact that Tsutomu´s blood was in the crime scene it´s probably because he was wounded by Kohji, thus this he had to disappear from
public scene, sending that strange message to Mary. Even though he might still have allies and people infiltrated in the FBI and CIA.
I believe Tsutomu Akai is Rum, he seems to be an intelligent man, mysterious and really linked to the story.
I think it´s very clear thar Rum is infiltrated in the good side, he´s Nº 2 inside BO, and they usually are one step beyond.
The only reason I think the boss didn´t punish Rum after the Kohji Haneda case it´s because he is a fundamental piece inside BO.

I don´t know who could be Kuroda and why he has such interest in Rumi. He could be someone that knows that Tsutomu was a BO infiltrated, he could be Tsutomu or someone related to the case. He is for sure related to RUM and that accident years ago.

Rumi´s existence is clear, she just wants to know who is Rum. That´s why she always ends in cases aside Conan or police members. She believes Rum is infiltrated there. So she is stating that she is ASACA and she is the one that fixed the dying message in order to incriminate Rum, she is the one that is uploading info from the case and she is probably investigating BO since that crime. She wants to make them nervous.

Another thing, maybe the BO believes that Rum could be an old, strong built and feminine from this crime. Tsutomu, in order to hide his identity could play ASACA, Amanda´s bodyguard can reunite this three affirmations. Feminine because the long hair , strong built because he was a bodyguard and old because 17 years passed...But anyway, this is just a weak assumption to fill another hole!

I know this theory has some holes, but not more holes than Kohji´s case had haha.

[MeiTanteixX]

As MeiTanteiXX stated in the RUM arc post it is very possible that Rumi was Kohji´s bodyguard and at the same time, had a sentimental relationship with him. Amanda couldn´t rely in BO, either FBI or CIA (it is very possible that RUM could be infiltrated in CIA or FBI , makes sense because normally is the good side that have people infiltrated in the BO.

Cross "Rumi" and change it to "Asaka". I never mentioned Rumi in the "Kohji case" discussion post, or the rest that wasn't highlighted here.

At this point, I fully doubt Tsutomu is a bad guy, nonetheless Rum.