Mystery Poll: Poll #37

[PT]

"Scotch is actually still alive..."

Because this is DC. Nobody important dies in DC.

[Commi-Ninja]

I went with Akai found out and told the organization. Which would be indirectly causing his death.

[DCUniverseAficionado]

Nobody important dies in DC.

True, but Ethan Hondo and Akemi were important characters whose deaths carried meaning in the story—Scotch could be another case of this.

[Kor]

Initially (after 898) my go-to reaction was that Akai killed him, but then thought it was too "morally gray" for Akai (he was a BO member so he should be on the gray department, but after all of what has happened, I kinda feel like Gosho "white knighted" him along the way). So later I changed my mind to Akai finding out Scotch was a spy and let the BO know so he'll step up in the ranks - that's sort of what Amuro was trying to with Akai do so it could be an interesting eye for an eye situation, but even that seems kinda too morally gray for how Akai is now.

When creating this poll I kinda did some more brainstorming and thought of this theory: Scotch was about to be found out by the organization, which would have also risked Amuro's status, so he asked Akai to kill him and Akai agreed (without letting Akai know Amuro is also a spy). Amuro never learned of this, though, hence his hatred for Akai.
With this, Akai's actions are not too morally gray. It is a bit of retreading of Kir's backstory, but it's not like anything else in this arc was an original piece of thought

So my impression is that (as far as the poll goes) either Akai killed Scotch, or he indirectly caused his death. Against my better judgement, I'll go with the Akai killing option. Even if you add justifications to it, I still somewhat can't really see Gosho making a character like Akai do a morally gray action at this point.

[PT]

Nobody important dies in DC.

True, but Ethan Hondo and Akemi were important characters whose deaths carried meaning in the story—Scotch could be another case of this.

Maybe, but why bring up a BO member who was high enough rank to even have a codename (note: even Akemi didn't have one), only to kill him more or less off-screen before he even speaks? Tequila died at the same time he appeared, but Scotch only appears in flashbacks or is mentioned or whatever.

[Kor]

Nobody important dies in DC.

True, but Ethan Hondo and Akemi were important characters whose deaths carried meaning in the story—Scotch could be another case of this.

Maybe, but why bring up a BO member who was high enough rank to even have a codename (note: even Akemi didn't have one), only to kill him more or less off-screen before he even speaks? Tequila died at the same time he appeared, but Scotch only appears in flashbacks or is mentioned or whatever.

... Damn, I was gonna dismiss the Scotch being alive theory for eternity, but you do raise an interesting point.
Maybe it's just an excuse to stack up another mystery surrounding Scotch's true identity but he really did die? (not that we have any realistic candidate for Scotch). Or maybe Akai and Amuro will also get a giant flashback later on featuring Scotch. Or maybe Scotch did die but left some sort of info that will be recovered later?
Just throwing out possibilities. I will be very sad if Scotch turns out to be alive.

Kor's list of potential things that will make him sad:
1) Shuukichi is the middle brother
2) Sera's mother and Elena are sisters
3) Scotch is actually alive

[Uchiha Shadow]

Nobody important dies in DC.

True, but Ethan Hondo and Akemi were important characters whose deaths carried meaning in the story—Scotch could be another case of this.

Maybe, but why bring up a BO member who was high enough rank to even have a codename (note: even Akemi didn't have one), only to kill him more or less off-screen before he even speaks? Tequila died at the same time he appeared, but Scotch only appears in flashbacks or is mentioned or whatever.

... Damn, I was gonna dismiss the Scotch being alive theory for eternity, but you do raise an interesting point.
Maybe it's just an excuse to stack up another mystery surrounding Scotch's true identity but he really did die? (not that we have any realistic candidate for Scotch). Or maybe Akai and Amuro will also get a giant flashback later on featuring Scotch. Or maybe Scotch did die but left some sort of info that will be recovered later?
Just throwing out possibilities. I will be very sad if Scotch turns out to be alive.

Kor's list of potential things that will make him sad:
1) Shuukichi is the middle brother
2) Sera's mother and Elena are sisters
3) Scotch is actually alive

I don't know about 3 but 1 and 2 I'm pretty sure are true, especially 1.

[cchanged]

Nobody important dies in DC.

True, but Ethan Hondo and Akemi were important characters whose deaths carried meaning in the story—Scotch could be another case of this.

Maybe, but why bring up a BO member who was high enough rank to even have a codename (note: even Akemi didn't have one), only to kill him more or less off-screen before he even speaks? Tequila died at the same time he appeared, but Scotch only appears in flashbacks or is mentioned or whatever.

... Damn, I was gonna dismiss the Scotch being alive theory for eternity, but you do raise an interesting point.
Maybe it's just an excuse to stack up another mystery surrounding Scotch's true identity but he really did die? (not that we have any realistic candidate for Scotch). Or maybe Akai and Amuro will also get a giant flashback later on featuring Scotch. Or maybe Scotch did die but left some sort of info that will be recovered later?
Just throwing out possibilities. I will be very sad if Scotch turns out to be alive.

Kor's list of potential things that will make him sad:
1) Shuukichi is the middle brother
2) Sera's mother and Elena are sisters
3) Scotch is actually alive

Kor, unfortunately, you are probably going to be sad for number one and two. Number one is almost confirmed. As for number two, it is implied that MG will be one of the sisters. Number three? I would think that Scotch is actually dead (hopefully), or else Amuro will look really stupid and the whole Bourbon Arc will appear even more pointless. :X It is also possible that Akai accidentally exposed Scotch's true identity which forced Amuro to kill Scotch (so he wouldn't be tortured for intelligence; there must be a reason why Scotch died before his real name was even found out and why this was mentioned at all.) Perhaps Amuro mistakenly believe that Akai had intentionally ratted out Scotch in order to advance his own rank, and this is why Amuro wanted to revenge in a similar way.

[Uchiha Shadow]

Nobody important dies in DC.

True, but Ethan Hondo and Akemi were important characters whose deaths carried meaning in the story—Scotch could be another case of this.

Maybe, but why bring up a BO member who was high enough rank to even have a codename (note: even Akemi didn't have one), only to kill him more or less off-screen before he even speaks? Tequila died at the same time he appeared, but Scotch only appears in flashbacks or is mentioned or whatever.

... Damn, I was gonna dismiss the Scotch being alive theory for eternity, but you do raise an interesting point.
Maybe it's just an excuse to stack up another mystery surrounding Scotch's true identity but he really did die? (not that we have any realistic candidate for Scotch). Or maybe Akai and Amuro will also get a giant flashback later on featuring Scotch. Or maybe Scotch did die but left some sort of info that will be recovered later?
Just throwing out possibilities. I will be very sad if Scotch turns out to be alive.

Kor's list of potential things that will make him sad:
1) Shuukichi is the middle brother
2) Sera's mother and Elena are sisters
3) Scotch is actually alive

Kor, unfortunately, you are probably going to be sad for number one and two. Number one is almost confirmed. As for number two, it is implied that MG will be one of the sisters. Number three? I would think that Scotch is actually dead (hopefully), or else Amuro will look really stupid and the whole Bourbon Arc will appear even more pointless. :X It is also possible that Akai accidentally exposed Scotch's true identity which forced Amuro to kill Scotch (so he wouldn't be tortured for intelligence; there must be a reason why Scotch died before his real name was even found out and why this was mentioned at all.) Perhaps Amuro mistakenly believe that Akai had intentionally ratted out Scotch in order to advance his own rank, and this is why Amuro wanted to revenge in a similar way.

I completely agree.

[DCUniverseAficionado]

Kor's list of potential things that will make him sad:
1) Shuukichi is the middle brother
2) Sera's mother and Elena are sisters
3) Scotch is actually alive

Only three, huh? I'd guess you'd probably have more, but only you know how many you have.

What is the purpose of having Shukichi turn out to be a red herring, and the middle brother being non-existent? Just wondering.

Jury's still out on who's the second sister, but odds are that Masumi's mother is the first.

Scotch will likely appear in an eventual flashback, but for him to turn out to be alive would be quite confusing.

[Kor]

Only three, huh? I'd guess you'd probably have more, but only you know how many you have.

It's a list in progress.
But more seriously, when I'm writing a thing such as "Kor's list of potential things that will make him sad" I'm probably just being extremely cheeky and there's no need to take it so seriously.

What is the purpose of having Shukichi turn out to be a red herring, and the middle brother being non-existent? Just wondering.

What is the purpose of making Shuukichi be Shuichi's and Masumi's brother? What is the purpose of having this middle brother exist at all? (I'm asking because as of yet no one really answered these questions).
I admitted on multiple occasions already that making the middle brother be non-existent doesn't really serve any sort of purpose. But this mystery (whether he exists or doesn't exist) is bizarre regardless. Conan himself doesn't seem to have any interest over this issue, so even on a narrative level it doesn't seem to be important.
But if the middle brother doesn't exist, and Sera has been in contact with Akai, that's actually a pretty nice development for her because it means she knows her dead brother is actually alive.

[Uchiha Shadow]

Only three, huh? I'd guess you'd probably have more, but only you know how many you have.

It's a list in progress.
But more seriously, when I'm writing a thing such as "Kor's list of potential things that will make him sad" I'm probably just being extremely cheeky and there's no need to take it so seriously.

What is the purpose of having Shukichi turn out to be a red herring, and the middle brother being non-existent? Just wondering.

What is the purpose of making Shuukichi be Shuichi's and Masumi's brother? What is the purpose of having this middle brother exist at all? (I'm asking because as of yet no one really answered these questions).
I admitted on multiple occasions already that making the middle brother be non-existent doesn't really serve any sort of purpose. But this mystery (whether he exists or doesn't exist) is bizarre regardless. Conan himself doesn't seem to have any interest over this issue, so even on a narrative level it doesn't seem to be important.
But if the middle brother doesn't exist, and Sera has been in contact with Akai, that's actually a pretty nice development for her because it means she knows her dead brother is actually alive.

Well it's too late for that to be the case, if Shuukichi wasn't the middle brother then him knowing how smart Conan is even though they never met before wouldn't make any sense and so far Shuukichi makes perfect sense while every other person does not so it can't be another character, not to mention it's already semi-confirmed by Gosho when he said in the Animal Crossing Game "Sera-san calls Kichi-nii" I believe it was. Besides, if the middle brother didn't exist how would you explain the middle brother's high-school friends? They are proof that he exists, since they call him Sera-san, while Shuichi never changed his name from Akai, and I doubt Akai would talk with her and let her know he's alive, he wouldn't want to put her in danger. But I do agree that it doesn't seem to have any purpose as of yet, we still don't know much about his involvement with the plot.

[Kor]

Well it's too late for that to be the case, if Shuukichi wasn't the middle brother then him knowing how smart Conan is even though they never met before wouldn't make any sense and so far Shuukichi makes perfect sense while every other person does not so it can't be another character, not to mention it's already semi-confirmed by Gosho when he said in the Animal Crossing Game "Sera-san calls Kichi-nii" I believe it was.

Other people in the series figured out Conan is smart too even though they've never met him. Also, Shuukichi doesn't really make perfect sense (that is, if we believe Sera's words). "It seems that he's in the middle of an important job and won't even tell me where he is now". So like, I know Shuukichi is a horrible human being, but this sort of narrative makes him even more despicable. His older brother died (and his mother potentially shrank), and he's busy playing shogi with the intention of getting back his girlfriend? All while not even telling Sera what he's doing, and turning her down from living with him? I mean, Sera can be pretty obnoxious, but still. (Not to mention he's famous enough to be recognized in random places, so Sera just happens to be as oblivious as Yumi is?) How does any of this work with Shuukichi being the brother?
(As far as the AC thing goes, that can just as well go into another direction and Gosho is just misdirecting us.)

Besides, if the middle brother didn't exist how would you explain the middle brother's high-school friends? They are proof that he exists, since they call him Sera-san, while Shuichi never changed his name from Akai, and I doubt Akai would talk with her and let her know he's alive, he wouldn't want to put her in danger. But I do agree that it doesn't seem to have any purpose as of yet, we still don't know much about his involvement with the plot.

Those high school friends are a living proof that Masumi had a brother who studied with them, not that she has a second brother who studied with them. And about Akai changing his name, you might want to get back to that file and reread those lines of dialogue. The assumption that Akai is the original surname is completely yours (we don't know what Conan was truly about to say, and even if he was about to say "Akai" that doesn't mean it's true).
Wouldn't want to put her in danger? She's already been in danger at the Mystery Train, when she didn't know he was alive. Letting her know that the fake "him" that she saw on the train isn't really him seems like a better idea than completely leaving her in the dark, when she has already been targeted.

At this point this is pretty much a rehash on my part. All of these things have already been written in one way or another in the first few pages of this thread (with a link or two provided by jimmy for more potential stuff on it).

[Uchiha Shadow]

Well it's too late for that to be the case, if Shuukichi wasn't the middle brother then him knowing how smart Conan is even though they never met before wouldn't make any sense and so far Shuukichi makes perfect sense while every other person does not so it can't be another character, not to mention it's already semi-confirmed by Gosho when he said in the Animal Crossing Game "Sera-san calls Kichi-nii" I believe it was.

Other people in the series figured out Conan is smart too even though they've never met him. Also, Shuukichi doesn't really make perfect sense (that is, if we believe Sera's words). "It seems that he's in the middle of an important job and won't even tell me where he is now". So like, I know Shuukichi is a horrible human being, but this sort of narrative makes him even more despicable. His older brother died (and his mother potentially shrank), and he's busy playing shogi with the intention of getting back his girlfriend? All while not even telling Sera what he's doing, and turning her down from living with him? I mean, Sera can be pretty obnoxious, but still. (Not to mention he's famous enough to be recognized in random places, so Sera just happens to be as oblivious as Yumi is?) How does any of this work with Shuukichi being the brother?
(As far as the AC thing goes, that can just as well go into another direction and Gosho is just misdirecting us.)

Besides, if the middle brother didn't exist how would you explain the middle brother's high-school friends? They are proof that he exists, since they call him Sera-san, while Shuichi never changed his name from Akai, and I doubt Akai would talk with her and let her know he's alive, he wouldn't want to put her in danger. But I do agree that it doesn't seem to have any purpose as of yet, we still don't know much about his involvement with the plot.

Those high school friends are a living proof that Masumi had a brother who studied with them, not that she has a second brother who studied with them. And about Akai changing his name, you might want to get back to that file and reread those lines of dialogue. The assumption that Akai is the original surname is completely yours (we don't know what Conan was truly about to say, and even if he was about to say "Akai" that doesn't mean it's true).
Wouldn't want to put her in danger? She's already been in danger at the Mystery Train, when she didn't know he was alive. Letting her know that the fake "him" that she saw on the train isn't really him seems like a better idea than completely leaving her in the dark, when she has already been targeted.

At this point this is pretty much a rehash on my part. All of these things have already been written in one way or another in the first few pages of this thread (with a link or two provided by jimmy for more potential stuff on it).

I need an example of characters who already knew of Conan's intelligence when they just met him, because to my recollection, there was no one, all of them were surprised with how smart he is, except Shuukichi who knew he solved the case and Sera who we know met him before, also, just because he is a bad person to you doesn't change the fact that he thinks collecting Shogi titles is an important job, which is what Sera said, so that argument does not really count, as far as the argument of why he's the middle bro, I'll just copy paste what I said in the middle brother's thread:

The middle brother is Shukichi Haneda, and to me it's very obvious, the reason why is because: He doesn't look like Sera/Akai as he looks like their father, he is 28, the perfect age for the middle brother since his classmates from high-school are all 27-29, his skin color matches the skin color that the middle brother has, his name is very similar to Shuichi, in Japan they sometimes name children by similar names, he is very smart, smart enough for Sera to put him as smarter than Shuichi, he trusted Conan from the first case even though he never met him before(as Conan), the middle brother knows about Shinichi since the Wizard is most likely Shinichi, and the middle brother asked Sera about him, since Shukichi's memory is very good, he would remember child Shinichi's face and know that he is Conan, the middle brother also knew of Conan, that fits with Shukichi because he just met Conan a few cases before he messaged her about him, and finally when he won the Shogi tournament, Shuichi seemed happy as he smiled when he read the news, and the unknown child was also very happy in an unusual way after watching the match. While some people say that he can't be the middle brother because he is famous and Sera should know about his whereabouts, the thing is though, Yumi, of all people didn't know that he was a famous Shogi player, despite dating him, and the detective boys including Haibara didn't realize he was the Taiko Meijin until they looked carefully at the picture, besides Sera probably isn't into Shogi so she probably doesn't know the Taiko Meijin.

When you add all that to the Animal Crossing Game, it becomes obvious.

Sera said that she and her 2nd brother changed their names, that means that the oldest brother didn't, and so far his name is Akai, thus it's obvious that the original name is Akai, we don't need confirmation for obvious things like that, it's clear that Gosho is just teasing us right now which is why he didn't let Conan say Akai. Letting Sera know he's alive would make her under even more danger than before, and after the mystery train in the Kaito Kid case, she said that it was impossible that the hat was her brother's hat, which means she probably still doubts that Akai is alive, she is still not sure that Scar Akai is the real Akai.

[Kor]

just because he is a bad person to you doesn't change the fact that he thinks collecting Shogi titles is an important job, which is what Sera said, so that argument does not really count,

That's not a thing Shuukichi has any reason to hide. Why can't he tell her what he's doing when a random person on the street knows what he's doing? This is kind of a big issue as far as the middle brother characterization goes, and Shuukichi just doesn't really fit the bill, because this behavior just doesn't make sense on his part (nor does Sera's apparent extreme obliviousness when her whole family seems to know what this supposed "middle brother" is doing).

Sera said that she and her 2nd brother changed their names, that means that the oldest brother didn't, and so far his name is Akai, thus it's obvious that the original name is Akai, we don't need confirmation for obvious things like that, it's clear that Gosho is just teasing us right now which is why he didn't let Conan say Akai.

Sera also said her mother is still in America, does that mean MG can't be the mother? Like, you know, Sera has been lying and withholding information from Conan (for some reason), so how do you know that this whole middle brother story is true. How do you know which parts should be taken wholeheartedly and which parts shouldn't?

Letting Sera know he's alive would make her under even more danger than before,

How so?