Why do people dislike Ran?

[coolshiho2]

I feel she is a kind of exhibitionist, and often wanders around half-naked. Disgusting.

Ooops, it looks like I unintentionally changed the topic.

Ran certainly does some are-you-serious things, and that's why I'm not in fond of her. In addition, I'd like to see female characters in DC to less reveal their body :\ I'm not that happy to see them (Ex. Ep 762 or sth where Ran slips the towel and thus making Conan nosebleed) so often. Especially Ran, because I've seen her exposed body several times and I think that is backfiring on her. (Don't underrate yourself DC) <- Plz correct me if this is just a minor opinion

[kkslider5552000]

I feel she is a kind of exhibitionist, and often wanders around half-naked. Disgusting.

not sure if serious

[DCUniverseAficionado]

I feel she is a kind of exhibitionist, and often wanders around half-naked. Disgusting.

not sure if serious

I certainly hope not.

[red.orchid]

Woah. It's still going on, huh...

[kkslider5552000]

Woah. It's still going on, huh...

I'm also surprised tbh. Honestly impressed it took this long for me to think "yeah, no one is adding to the main conversation anymore".

[megamind1988]

one of the best things of ran is that she feels so extremely sorry for the culprits.

for example first episode she felt sorry for the girl that beheaded her ex-boyfriend and she remorsefully confesed the crime, poor girl.

[megamind1988]

whenever i write a reply i feel like you don't care about what i say, i'm part of dctp.ws even when i write private messages you only care about others except me.
http://safebooru.org//images/1129/95af7 ... pg?1174108

[char13happy]

Oooh, boy. *readies popcorn*

[Kor]

whenever i write a reply i feel like you don't care about what i say, i'm part of dctp.ws even when i write private messages you only care about others except me.
http://safebooru.org//images/1129/95af7 ... pg?1174108

You might want to reread all of your past posts until now. The majority of your posts deal with how you feel sympathy to various female culprits in Detective Conan. Beyond that, there isn't much content, and you're just sort of repeating yourself over and over. If people aren't replying to your posts or you feel like people ignore you, it might be because there's not much to reply to in the first place.

But please don't make posts to cry for attention in the future. Those just make your situation worse because people are going to take you even less seriously.

[Suhooo]

I feel she is a kind of exhibitionist, and often wanders around half-naked. Disgusting.

Now I can't agree with you. I believe Ran never showed that she thinks like that.


To bring this thread back to the main topic, I finally read the whole thread (although I skimmed through the lengthy ones), and found out that some points that I think are not mentioned yet. Well, they are, but not to full extent.

1. Ran's physical ability is great while her inner thoughts may be confusing. Whenever the matter relates to Shinichi, she seems to be trying to be a-bit-too faithful to him. Like the Tori case, where she went nice(?) and tried to verbally persuade the gangsters. If she didn't listen to the fortunetelling, she would have just simply beat the cr*p out of them. She cannot just give up her karate skills even though the fortunetelling (which, I personally believe to be nonsense) tells that she should be less manly. (And be more... what, womanly? Like the 'traditional domestic Asian' woman.)

I believe we all watched the Anime Episode #648~650 where the Mouri Detective Agency was held as hostage, and there, Ran made an awful mistake. Who would not let the police arrest the criminal when everyone's life is at risk? She justifies her action as 'because Shinichi would never have let anyone die in front of him', which shows that Ran just accepted Shinichi's way of thinking, and that is not justifiable. Would she rather put everyone's life (including hers) into high risk than saving everyone, just to pursue her belief on 'I will not let anybody(culprit) die in front of me even though he/she is ready to detonate bomb that will kill all of us'?

2. Ran becomes suspicious of Shinichi flirting with other women several times, which hints her something-like-tenacity. It may sound like a leap on logic, but (I can't recall the episode #) there was a case when Ran went mad against a teenager client who claimed Shinichi to be her boyfriend. She imagined that he made fun out of her and disposed of her. (Okay, this may not be true because I cannot remember this accurately enough but she DID think Shinichi was being unfaithful to her) Later in that episode, when she and Conan went to the criminal's house, she smashes the door. (Which can be assumed because Ran was furious, and that house was believed to be the place where Shinichi was staying at that point) In the end, it says that it took a few more days until she finally dissolved her false belief that Shinichi was the client's girlfriend, despite the truth the client and Conan was trying to convince Ran that Shinichi was never the client's boyfriend. (He never was, of course.)

Or the Anime Episode 398~399, (Manga book #46~47 fyi) when she thinks of another imagination of Shinichi flirting with a hot woman only because the text message she sent to Shinichi probably went to the phone that Conan was having. Well, she may feel betrayed, but the reaction she showed was a bit too much. She was like, 'All right, I'm gonna beat the c**p out of you, Shinichi.' What I wanna say is that she made the leap of her thought. A text message that is sent to Conan's phone cannot simply make her think that he is 'blocking a girl who is sleeping with him from seeing Ran's text message' or 'mocking her text message with another girl that he(Shinichi) intently sent to Conan's phone' <-her lines from the manga. She imagines Shinichi and another girl being naked and lying on the same bed & looking at her text message that is sent to Conan's phone and laughing at it. Which is against her usual belief on Shinichi will return to her eventually. Why would she contradict herself is she firmly believes that, alongside of his constant phone calls and physical contacts to ensure her? Her thoughts are too extreme to just put them as 'because she was getting tired of Shinichi not staying with her'.

Yes, I don't like Ran. (It is okay to say this... right?)

[Kleene Onigiri]

So what's your message Suhooo? (i like your 3 o's)

So you don't like it that Ran is not violent aka not using her karate or using force and also too trustful of shinichi (1.)
but at the same time, you think Ran is too violent, uses her karate too much/violently and is not trusting shinichi (2.) enough?

...?

The problem with your 2 point is, that you look at ran at different times.
1. is Ran in the newer episodes and 2. is Ran in the earlier (or even very early) episodes.

The point where Ran uses her karate to smash objects like doors or a pole were very early in the manga, where Ran's character wasn't even established fully (and it changed a bit too). Also, in that "old time" mangas often used violence as a comedy effect. Gosho stopped used that comedy effect later on (although poor conan still got a lot of bumps on his head from kogoro)
So it's hard to compare that to the newer episodes (it's like complaining that the bento-fax machine from agasa isn't in the newest episodes anymore XD)

And everyone is complaining about that Tori with that fortune thingy case... I didn't like how Ran acted here either. But that case wasn't about showing character development. Gosho usually likes to educate his readers. And in Japan a lot of female teenagers read horoscopes and fortunes and such stuff (not sure, maybe even more than in the western world?). So he wanted to show to the reader, that you should stay true to yourself (tho it was Rans fortune that told her that :x).

So why was Ran chosen for that? First, because the role for that had to be female and a teenager. There aren't many to chose from that: Ran, Sonoko, Kazuha and maybe Haibara.
Haibara doesn't work, because Haibara doesn't do any Karate or such things. And the role had to get into danger because of the changes the fortune tells you to. (tho it would be hilarious when Haibara is told to be more cheerful and her love would be fulfilled (or some stuff like that). Imagine Ai suddenly being all cheerful (forced cheerfulness/bad acting) towards Conan and Conan would be confused by that XD I actually wanna see that)

Kazuha would work, but then you'd need a reason for Kazuha to appear. It was a smaller case so it didn't happen.
Sonoko was actually the "culprit" that swapped the fortunes to tease Ran. It's also Sonoko that convinced Ran to act like that fortune said, Ran was actually septic at first.

The 2 points, where you complain about Ran being too jealous but at the same time believing in Shinichi coming back(2.) are also at 2 different times in the manga. The jealous parts is very early (the one where the the girl pretends to be Shinichi's girlfriend) and the one where Conan gets a message or something is also quite early in the manga. Here Shinichi just disappeared some time ago and Shinichi didn't really had much contact with her yet. I think shinichi just phoned her and didn't show up as his "big self" personally yet at all. (just his shadow XD) So Ran was worried a lot about him and then she learns that he has a girlfriend and she flipped XD
Later on Shinichi actually shows Ran that he's worried about her but that he just can't come back yet. That's why she starts to trust him and is waiting for him (she might not have done so if shinichi didn't show his loyalty maybe?)

Who would not let the police arrest the criminal when everyone's life is at risk? She justifies her action as 'because Shinichi would never have let anyone die in front of him', which shows that Ran just accepted Shinichi's way of thinking, and that is not justifiable.

I don't agree with that part.
We saw in the New York Case (Golden Apple case) that Ran saved a person who then murdered someone else. The culprit guild tripped Ran afterwards, telling her that she could only kill that guy because Ran saved her (or something like that). I think everyone would be shocked to hear that.
So Ran was depressed and confused. Then Ran and Shinichi encountered that serial killer (who was Vermouth) and Ran also immediately reacted and saved Vermouth from falling. (shinichi helping out) Vermouth, confused why she was saved, asked for the reason. Ran didn't know why (still confused because of the guilt tripping), but Shinichi agreed with Ran's action that you don't need a reason to help another person.

This also changed Vermouth I guess, because after that she calls Ran an Angel, because god never helped Vermouth before (or something like that). Vermouth turned into an ally (or is in favor of) Shinichi and Ran because of that too. Now imagine if that didn't happen. If Vermouth died, someone else would be after Sherry, probably Gin... and Conan & Co. would be long dead XD And if Vermouth survived the fall she wouldn't care whether Conan and Ran would die or not.... and Conan & Co. would be dead too XD

Ran never "just accepted Shinichi's way of thinking", she always thought the same way on her own, from the start. But Shinichi was the one that encouraged her to stay like that and told her that she doesn't need a reason to help others.

Personally, I love Ran for that thinking. I like how she saved the culprit that was about to be sniped instead of just watching him die. She didn't want to be saved when someone else has to die for that when there is still another possibility. And if Ran didn't do it, Shinichi would definitely have saved the culprit, telling him to not stand too close to the windows because he might get sniped. (you can see that with Conan/Shinichi's reaction to what Sera was saying in order to lure the culprit to the windows)

Conan also once convinced Takagi to not arrest an attempted murder. There was this one man that tried to kill his pregnant wife because of some misunderstanding (he was stressed or something?) but failed to kill her. His wife forgave him and the culprit showed remorse too. Takagi agreed with conan, tho Haibara disagreed (although Haibara herself created a poison and was in an evil organization... which would mean Haibara should be arrested to according to her own logic? Her reaction made me dislike her)

[megamind1988]

it's true that ran it's a tsundere?

[kkslider5552000]

Conan also once convinced Takagi to not arrest an attempted murder. There was this one man that tried to kill his pregnant wife because of some misunderstanding (he was stressed or something?) but failed to kill her. His wife forgave him and the culprit showed remorse too. Takagi agreed with conan, tho Haibara disagreed (although Haibara herself created a poison and was in an evil organization... which would mean Haibara should be arrested to according to her own logic? Her reaction made me dislike her)

Oooh boy, let's open that can of worms...

"tried to kill his pregnant wife". Honestly, I'm not sure I have to add anything here. I could just quote this. The thing is, in some way I appreciate what Gosho was trying to, an actual moral dilemma with the characters having two different opinions on what should happen. But in a series so constantly obsessed with saying that trying to kill a person is ALWAYS, ALWAYS, ALWAYS horrible (especially from Conan himself), you can't decide to make the near-death of a pregnant woman, the time to try to be more understanding! That's not how this works just because she was lucky enough to survive!

And while you can make a case for Haibara being hypocritical, that's such a minor point that it doesn't actually matter. That entire case is probably ruined by that ending. Honestly, it's one saving grace is that it's so...bat**** crazy and so bizarre for this series that it's hard to even take it seriously as canon (whereas Ran's behavior is distressingly believable). I realize this is only partially related to why you brought it up, but it is not a good example for anything good.

[Kleene Onigiri]

In that case people had different views a lot.

My point was that Conan doesn't judge purely by law and actually cares about the people involved: Culprit. Victim and any other people that might get effected by the crime ("second-hand victims") Ran is the same and it was shown that she did that on her own from the start.
For Conan, there are also other cases: Moonlight Sonata. He felt guilty that the culprit committed suicide. In another case together with heiji, he stopped a culprit from suicide. Conan doesn't want the culprits to die, he want's them to "pay for their crimes" (not sure if I use the right wording), so that the other victims won't have a need for revenge. And that happened with the pregnant wife, since she forgave her husband.

I'm not sure why you think Haibara's reaction was a minor point. I think she doesn't have the same morals views as Shinichi and Ran. She wouldn't help others without a reason and thus she also wouldn't easily forgive others (and she also doesn't forgive herself so easily I guess? :/ )

[kkslider5552000]

I'm not sure why you think Haibara's reaction was a minor point. I think she doesn't have the same morals views as Shinichi and Ran. She wouldn't help others without a reason and thus she also wouldn't easily forgive others (and she also doesn't forgive herself so easily I guess? :/ )

Well it's minor in the sense that that ending is so horribad that any thoughts about it beyond that get sucked into a black hole, never to be seen again. There is no way I can see it as anything other than a contradiction to the series itself. There's justification for why it exists in terms of the characters and story I'm sure, but the execution doesn't fit even my most open-minded look at how these characters and this story is like.

Please correct me if I'm wrong, but he did not really pay for his crime. Especially taking into account how HORRIBLY DARK it could've ended up as.

Though I feel you did sum up one of the big problems of the series, that Gosho sometimes focuses on his own character's archetype instead of how they differ from an archetype.