Chekhov MacG Memorial Thread for White Day Murder (Files 725

[RedPoppy]

Nobody listen to me on the C-box (except Misztina-my favourite partner to chat about that case theory and Nyarl), so maybe I should post it right here. Your way of thinking are great! The result of my and Misztina's deduction -> 

I guess it was like that - she put a poison while taking her drink (1st weird moment which made Conan think), the husband took a medicine earlier and then when he thought it's the most effective, he took the lemon and died. The wife took the lemon from his mouth and hide it (maybe in her heels while kneeling?). Everybody were focus on Kogoro's action, so she had a time to put another lemon (normal one - she knew that the police will take all the drinks to examinate). Then she need to get rid of the poisonous lemon, she pretended to sprain her ankle and threw the lemon. Then she was calm, nobody will find a poison in her clothes. However it's weird that Sato didn't smell the poison in wife's heel - I guess it should smell like almond too. Now I'm thinking... The reason why the husband didn't eat anything - the wife said he couldn't eat that late because of metabolism. Maybe he had problems with his maw?? Probably he had a problems with an acid in his stomach. People with this shouldn't eat late, be on special diet and avoid sour things like lemon juice. Otherwise they really suffer from stomach pain. I read about hydrogen cyanide,  it has a reaction with gastic acid. Hmm... Hydrogen cyanide divide in gastirc acid, but what could happen if somebody took a medicine for gastric acid? I guess the poison won't divide so fast, so the death will come later.

About napkin: hydrogen cyanide is inflammable, so I guess the paper napkin would burn much faster if the poison was there. guess normal paper without a poison will look identical like on that picture. Paper is inflammable too after all. Kogoro's cigarette would make a bigger fire than this, as we can see the cigarette was there for some time, so it's nothing weird that it started to burn the paper.
But I like theory about medicine which the victim could take before eating a lemon. As we read, he was bedridden after eating sour things, so maybe he wanted to prevent some...I don't know how to call it...sickness effects like vomiting.
If the poison was in the lemon, Conan would need to find that lemon as a proof. If the poison was in the napkin, Conan would ask Takagi to check this up, but if there was really the poison, why the wife didn't get rid of the napkin - the proof of her murder?? I'm sure she wanted to get rid of something else.

[acerola21]

My guess is the husband took the miracle fruit capsule (because they found a capsule remnant between his teeth)

Eh?  Capsule?  You mean wafer - the original Japanese is オブラート, which translates to "wafer" - apparently it's a a thin sheet of dry paste or the like, used to enclose a powder to be swallowed.  It dissolves really quickly once it gets inside your mouth.  Ha ha, this isn't your fault, though, since I grew up in Japan and I didn't know what it was until I googled it like crazy in both English and Japanese.

Guilty.  "Capsule" was a case of best approximation.  I felt that explaining that obulaato = oblate = wafer when "wafer" means

to most people would only add unnecessary confusion.  It was a gamble on my part that the distinction would not have bearing on the solution to the case.

Oh, that's what wafer usually means in English?  I googled "wafer" and these silicon-computer-y-thingies came up as the result, so I was confused, and I couldn't immediately recognize the pictures on the Wikipedia article because they don't look like the one you posted above. ^^;

And that's okay, I understand - Japanese just plain doesn't translate well into English, ha ha.

You need to chew the tablet/wafer/capsule thing and allow it to sit on your tongue for a while to work. That's why there was wafer remnants on his molars. It's no good in your stomach.

Oh yeah, this is miracle fruit, not some bitter medicine you're trying to swallow down - and miracle fruits don't work unless you chew on it.  Riiiiight . . . *smacks self in head*  Ha ha, yeah now I agree that the miracle fruit could have come in some sort of powdered form and wrapped in the wafer.

Also the lemons may be unpeeled already when they are stuck on the glass since they are whole circles. It would be hard to stick a circular slice of lemon on a glass with the peel still completely wrapped around it.

But, but the raw makes it look like there's peel on the lemon!  And hey, I found this image while googling.

I'm guessing the napkin shouldn't have been as burned as it is if it was still damp. I'm pretty sure the clue is the napkin on the table is dry when it shouldn't be.

About napkin: hydrogen cyanide is inflammable, so I guess the paper napkin would burn much faster if the poison was there. guess normal paper without a poison will look identical like on that picture. Paper is inflammable too after all.

Eh, for me, I didn't immediately think of the lack of condensed water since the other paper thingies didn't look like they had condensed water, so that's why I thought of lack of fire (not just burn, but catch on fire) - but then, we didn't get to look at the other papers close-up, so maybe not. *shrug*
And I didn't know you could use transparent text!  I'm totally going to play with this now.

[Chekhov MacGuffin]

But, but the raw makes it look like there's peel on the lemon!  And hey, I found this image while googling.

I'll concede on the lemon wedge, since an up close look at the lemons from a 3/4 view in the manga suggests there may be a peel around them with the darker shading. What an irritating way of putting lemons on a glass though. I suppose it keeps the shape...
It's fun for snarky comments more than anything but is also useful when needing to embed spoilers in spoilers. I simply guessed "transparent" was a color. Don't ask me for my logic in that because there wasn't any.

[acerola21]

But, but the raw makes it look like there's peel on the lemon!  And hey, I found this image while googling.

I'll concede on the lemon wedge, since an up close look at the lemons from a 3/4 view in the manga suggests there may be a peel around them with the darker shading. What an irritating way of putting lemons on a glass though. I suppose it keeps the shape...
It's fun for snarky comments more than anything but is also useful when needing to embed spoilers in spoilers. I simply guessed "transparent" was a color. Don't ask me for my logic in that because there wasn't any.

Yeah DC isn't completely realistic - so I usually pay attention to the manga for clues and ignore reality.   So I don't know much stuff about reality, ha ha.  And hey, white and black aren't technically colors (. . . or was it hues?) but people usually consider them colors so transparent could be one. *shrug*

[Akonyl]

But, but the raw makes it look like there's peel on the lemon!  And hey, I found this image while googling.

I'll concede on the lemon wedge, since an up close look at the lemons from a 3/4 view in the manga suggests there may be a peel around them with the darker shading. What an irritating way of putting lemons on a glass though. I suppose it keeps the shape...
It's fun for snarky comments more than anything but is also useful when needing to embed spoilers in spoilers. I simply guessed "transparent" was a color. Don't ask me for my logic in that because there wasn't any.

you've never seen lemons put on glasses with their peels on?

around here that's the only way lemons are ever put on glasses, I've never seen a peel-less one on a glass before.

[Kor]

But, but the raw makes it look like there's peel on the lemon!  And hey, I found this image while googling.

I'll concede on the lemon wedge, since an up close look at the lemons from a 3/4 view in the manga suggests there may be a peel around them with the darker shading. What an irritating way of putting lemons on a glass though. I suppose it keeps the shape...
It's fun for snarky comments more than anything but is also useful when needing to embed spoilers in spoilers. I simply guessed "transparent" was a color. Don't ask me for my logic in that because there wasn't any.

you've never seen lemons put on glasses with their peels on?

around here that's the only way lemons are ever put on glasses, I've never seen a peel-less one on a glass before.

Same here, I think this applies for most of the world.

tbh, I've never seen in my life a peel-less lemon at all.

[Chekhov MacGuffin]

But, but the raw makes it look like there's peel on the lemon!  And hey, I found this image while googling.

I'll concede on the lemon wedge, since an up close look at the lemons from a 3/4 view in the manga suggests there may be a peel around them with the darker shading. What an irritating way of putting lemons on a glass though. I suppose it keeps the shape...
It's fun for snarky comments more than anything but is also useful when needing to embed spoilers in spoilers. I simply guessed "transparent" was a color. Don't ask me for my logic in that because there wasn't any.

you've never seen lemons put on glasses with their peels on?

around here that's the only way lemons are ever put on glasses, I've never seen a peel-less one on a glass before.

Same here, I think this applies for most of the world.

tbh, I've never seen in my life a peel-less lemon at all.

I swear I've seen it done this way. This website on various ways to slice citrus suggests that cutting cartwheel slices can be done with peeled or unpeeled fruit. It makes sense to me to peel it if you want to eat the slice. My family must be an outlier then. I would like to note that it's a whole different story with wedges that are meant to be squeezed. Those always have their peel.

[acerola21]

Where I come from I don't see much fruits on cups at all, ha ha.  I have no idea how they're usually decorated, so I'll just take you guys' words.

[Akonyl]

Where I come from I don't see much fruits on cups at all, ha ha.  I have no idea how they're usually decorated, so I'll just take you guys' words.

the most common times I see lemons on cups is at restaurants where they're put on cups of diet coke/pepsi to differentiate them from normal coke/pepsi, but occasionally on plain water glasses also.

[Key-chan]

Where I come from I don't see much fruits on cups at all, ha ha.  I have no idea how they're usually decorated, so I'll just take you guys' words.

the most common times I see lemons on cups is at restaurants where they're put on cups of diet coke/pepsi to differentiate them from normal coke/pepsi, but occasionally on plain water glasses also.

And Ice Tea. Don't forget Ice Tea

[Akonyl]

Where I come from I don't see much fruits on cups at all, ha ha.  I have no idea how they're usually decorated, so I'll just take you guys' words.

the most common times I see lemons on cups is at restaurants where they're put on cups of diet coke/pepsi to differentiate them from normal coke/pepsi, but occasionally on plain water glasses also.

And Ice Tea. Don't forget Ice Tea

touché, sir.

If you are a sir.

Otherwise, touché, madam.

[Abs.]

And Ice Tea. Don't forget Ice Tea

touché, sir.

If you are a sir.

Otherwise, touché, madam.

Gender ambiguity strikes again 

[Key-chan]

And Ice Tea. Don't forget Ice Tea

touché, sir.

If you are a sir.

Otherwise, touché, madam.

Gender ambiguity strikes again 

You would think that my username Key-chan would point it out Which now makes me wonder...is there a gender thread somewhere? *goes to look for it*

[Akonyl]

And Ice Tea. Don't forget Ice Tea

touché, sir.

If you are a sir.

Otherwise, touché, madam.

Gender ambiguity strikes again  :o

You would think that my username Key-chan would point it out Which now makes me wonder...is there a gender thread somewhere? *goes to look for it*

hey now, some people use gender-confusing nicknames (or just use chan as a guy because they roll like that).

and it aint my fault, she hardly ever posts so I don't have much to go on : (

But, alrighty then.

[Nyarl]

Nobody listen to me on the C-box (except Misztina-my favourite partner to chat about that case theory and Nyarl), so maybe I should post it right here. Your way of thinking are great! The result of my and Misztina's deduction ->  

I guess it was like that - she put a poison while taking her drink (1st weird moment which made Conan think), the husband took a medicine earlier and then when he thought it's the most effective, he took the lemon and died. The wife took the lemon from his mouth and hide it (maybe in her heels while kneeling?). Everybody were focus on Kogoro's action, so she had a time to put another lemon (normal one - she knew that the police will take all the drinks to examinate). Then she need to get rid of the poisonous lemon, she pretended to sprain her ankle and threw the lemon. Then she was calm, nobody will find a poison in her clothes. However it's weird that Sato didn't smell the poison in wife's heel - I guess it should smell like almond too. Now I'm thinking... The reason why the husband didn't eat anything - the wife said he couldn't eat that late because of metabolism. Maybe he had problems with his maw?? Probably he had a problems with an acid in his stomach. People with this shouldn't eat late, be on special diet and avoid sour things like lemon juice. Otherwise they really suffer from stomach pain. I read about hydrogen cyanide,  it has a reaction with gastic acid. Hmm... Hydrogen cyanide divide in gastirc acid, but what could happen if somebody took a medicine for gastric acid? I guess the poison won't divide so fast, so the death will come later.

About napkin: hydrogen cyanide is inflammable, so I guess the paper napkin would burn much faster if the poison was there. guess normal paper without a poison will look identical like on that picture. Paper is inflammable too after all. Kogoro's cigarette would make a bigger fire than this, as we can see the cigarette was there for some time, so it's nothing weird that it started to burn the paper.
But I like theory about medicine which the victim could take before eating a lemon. As we read, he was bedridden after eating sour things, so maybe he wanted to prevent some...I don't know how to call it...sickness effects like vomiting.
If the poison was in the lemon, Conan would need to find that lemon as a proof. If the poison was in the napkin, Conan would ask Takagi to check this up, but if there was really the poison, why the wife didn't get rid of the napkin - the proof of her murder?? I'm sure she wanted to get rid of something else.

I think that's about right, combined with MacGuffin's Sour-to-Sweet Miracle "wafer" to make the lemon palatable to him. I'm thinking now that his previous bad reaction to sour stuff was actually another poisoning attempt, or just him really-really exaggerating (though that's why I was thinking allergies in the chat box). {Hmm... maybe he had an ulcer that gets irritated by sour acidic food...)

I wouldn't put a (thick skinned citrus) fruit slice in my mouth if it's not peeled, but that {could} be more cultural/personal preference than an actual problem with the idea that he tried to eat (or just suck on) a poisoned lemon slice.