Why do people dislike Ran?

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kirite
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Re: Why do people dislike Ran?

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ssjup81 wrote: To be honest, Japanese kids tend to be scary in general. I have high school students who are Ran-like when it comes to the stuff mentioned and its not really considered babyish. Those who are superstitious are also pretty common here. Maybe by western standards this is an annoyance, but normal to some extent for easterners. The way these high schoolers and even some of the adults reacts to such things, like American Halloween is amazing. Too scary for them. Can't help but wonder if that's the reason why a lot of the junk here is marketed to be "cute", and that includes Halloween.
I completely understand this actually since I grew up over there. For example my dad will never EVER celebrate Halloween. Walking by a cemetery? Forget about it. It's terrifying, extremely unlucky, and just inviting "curses" to him. I can't even have a skeleton decoration. He doesn't believe in fortune telling. But he believes if I plant a tree in front of the house I'm just going to invite bad fortune.

I guess the equivalent over here is ghost and fortune telling. I have American friends who believe in daily horoscopes (like legit believe in it). Or is too terrified to sleep after they watch Paranormal Activity. They don't believe in vampires, but they do believe in ghost that will possess and kill you.

It's kinda the same type of thing in Japan. Not everybody. Some people think it's stupid. But they're still out there. I guess some of us simply grew up with more superstition around us. Shrines in the new year, paying respect to our parents/grandparents in our house, scarier horror movies (lol), grandparents who will tell us about the time they saw fox fire in the mountains, etc etc...
Shiromi wrote:Yeah, I was shipping them at first too. As I got further and further into the series though, it fell out of favor for Shinichi/Shiho because their pasts make then able to relate with eachother more than they could to others. Also, less squick factor. I started shipping Sonoko/Ran because *deletes 2000 word essay about why they are perfect for eachother* er... Sonoko's outgoing personality balances Ran's slightly introverted personality. Also, Sonoko seems to have a fetish for martial artists. She cheers really enthusiastically for Ran at those tournaments... just saying...
Hi-5.

*Can also write 2000 word essay about why they're perfect together*

*Given I also ship RanxShiho because they're like destined together in my deranged mind*
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Re: Why do people dislike Ran?

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You know, the reason why I think Sonoko is like so much better than Ran, ironically, doesn't have a ton to do with anything I said (though you can likely see how these points connect). I always felt Ran was never meant to be all that believable of an actual, typical high school girl...ironic because that's how she's supposed to be written on some level I'm sure. Maybe Japan is way different in this regard but Sonoko is almost exactly like a lot of the girls I knew when I was in high school. Initially seeming like an obnoxious boy-obsessed spoiled girl, she's actually really fun to be around and is a pretty cool person once you get past that questionable first impression.
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Re: Why do people dislike Ran?

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kkslider5552000 wrote:You know, the reason why I think Sonoko is like so much better than Ran, ironically, doesn't have a ton to do with anything I said (though you can likely see how these points connect). I always felt Ran was never meant to be all that believable of an actual, typical high school girl...ironic because that's how she's supposed to be written on some level I'm sure.
Lol I always feel like the creation of Ran went like this:

Gosho: So this girl trolls Shinichi, kicks ass, is violent jealous, smart, and will smack Conan a good one for getting in trouble.

Someone: That's not attractive! She's scary and violent!

Gosho: Errr...I mean she's also an amazing cook, is the most beautiful girl, is cute, mature, and really gentle like a mom. Yup.

Sonoko didn't suffer the "she needs to be likable!1!" problem.
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Re: Why do people dislike Ran?

Post by AICHAN »

I never really liked Ran as much as I should.I mean, I always liked strong and beautiful heroin,and that's what I liked in Ran in the beginning...but I quickly found Ran too perfect for me,even her flaws aren't that bad,so it was difficult for me to be moved or impressed by her behaviour.
Not to mention that she's very static,we don't see a real evolution in her character.It's making her unrealistic.I really blame Gosho for that,he tries to make a her the perfect heroin,the perfect woman,but perfection is boring,especially in such a long manga like DC.
I hope Gosho will do something because Ran has a good potential to be a great character.
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Re: Why do people dislike Ran?

Post by Citan »

Shiromi wrote:I agree that the number of suspicion arcs is repetitive and overused, but I don't think that it reflects badly on Ran's character. In order to get rid of her suspicions, everyone who knows his secret has to work overtime, but she still knows something is up. She's the reason that Conan is able to get into so many crime scenes - she's noticed that his observations are extremely helpful is solving cases, to the point where it often seems like he's the one investigating, not the police. I recall one of the suspicion arcs that was from her POV, where she studies Conan's actions and realizes he's manipulating the police and detectives around him into figuring out the truth, that every single advance in the case was from his observations. But, a teenager turning into a gradeschooler is such a preposterous idea, it's just too difficult to wrap your head around until you figure out how it could be done. In the face of the "teenager somehow turned into little kid" theory, "super-smart little relative of Shinishi's who worships the ground Shinichi walks on" is a much more plausible explanation.
I understand that Ran is in an unfair predicament, and I do not, nor have I ever accused her of being stupid for not having figured it out yet. My problem is from a story writing standpoint and not in any way a slight on the character herself. I'll try to explain.

If Ran is as smart as people claim she is (again from a storyline standpoint) for continuing to suspect Conan after all this time, why hasn't she done more to investigate? Think about this in her point of view. Shinichi disappeared after Tropical world, and didn't contact her for days. She was on the verge of calling the police at the time. During this time Conan appeared and moved into her house. Shinichi refuses to tell her exactly where he is besides that he's on "a big case". Bear in mind he's never needed more than a day or two so solve a case.

Even if she didn't suspect Conan of being Shinichi shouldn't be a little more pro-active in figuring out why her childhood friend/love interest has fallen off the face of the earth? The "I'm on a big case" excuse should be an obvious lie even to her. Scratch that, ESPECIALLY to her. Yet she's content to just sit and wait before him and not ask any questions of ANYONE because he told her to? Shouldn't she at least make the rounds and see if anyone knows anything? I don't think she even called up Shinichi's parents to see if he was in america with them.

Then we get into Conan. Never no matter how sure she is has Ran ever confronted Conan with anything more than her say-so. Never has she tried in any way to verify his identity. For god sake she hasn't even thought to check his glasses. If she thinks Conan is Shinichi shouldn't she at least wonder why he's wearing glasses? no, she just runs off to confront him expecting him to confess. After the third or fourth time it should be obvious to her he's not going to talk without proof, and after years of being around detectives she should know enough to try and compile some before confronting the suspect.

So yes. I agree it says alot that Ran continues to suspect Conan despite the ample "proof" he's given her that she's wrong. I also believe she's been kept far too passive in her attempts to expose him than she should be if she really wanted to find out the truth once and for all. Or maybe I just got spoiled after reading "The Mystery Of Conan Edogawa" and seeing how, in my opinion, Ran's suspicions SHOULD be handled.

I supose alot of my hostility also comes from the "Reason" given for her to be kept out of the loop. If Ran's development hadn't been stalled for so log the flimsy excuse for keeping her in the dark wouldn't be so galling. The fact that nobody in on the secret has confronted Shinichi on his bullshit after all this time is even more frustrating.

Consider the following. Shinichi's reason for lying to Ran was because her knowing the truth would put her in the line of fire. Fine. At the time that was true. Then he proceeded to go live with her which rendered the entire thing irrelevant. If he had moved back to America, Ran's not knowing the truth could have saved her life, but by moving in with her he as good as signed her death warrant.

Why is this, you ask? Think about it. If Shinichi's identity is exposed to the organization the Mouri family are dead by proxy. They won't ask questions about it. They won't sit Ran down and ask nicely if she knows Conan is really Shinichi. They will assume Kogoro and Ran know exactly who Conan is and have been shielding him from them. To make a long story short: Ran's life is already in danger, and nobody even has the decency to tell her.

With all of the supposedly intelligent characters in the know surely one of them would spot this glaring logical hole in Shinichi's argument for Ran's protection and confront him on it, right? Apparently not. Everyone just accepts his decision and allows him to go on abusing Ran's love and trust just so he can lie to himself about her being safe. Frankly it's sickening.
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Re: Why do people dislike Ran?

Post by mamato »

First hello everyone, i'm very happy can speak with all of you. Nice to meet you ;)
Not to mention that she's very static,we don't see a real evolution in her character.It's making her unrealistic.
Well, don't see a very evolution because in Dc are passed only little months, (like jodie says in the volume 58) and i personally think is impossible changed in a little months. Even Shinichi is always the same, like even Megure and others.

Only character is changed is Haibara, but her changed is a story different and was necessary for the story of manga.

Said that i think Ran is a very great character that have much potential. i hope that Gosho stop focused on the new character and focused on principal characters like he made in the arc of Vermouth the more beautiful of the manga in my opinion.

sorry for my english
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Re: Why do people dislike Ran?

Post by magnolia88 »

It's funny if the topic changed from "Why people dislike Ran" into "Why I dont favor Shinichi-Ran's romance". I used to see Ran is a character created to be the main protagonist's lover. I never get interested to dig her personality. It's nice to read every opinions stated here from different point of views.
Yes, Haibara is the one who has character development which tied to the story. Unfortunately Ran and Shinichi dont change so much from the beginning. Shinichi is still cocky and reckless. Ran is just Ran. Most of my friends have dropped the series and maybe it's only me who still here reading DC. I cant stand sticking with DC for years if not because of Haibara and Black org. Even the cases dont interest me much again.

Am I the only one who wondering why Gosho has focused into Sera's family nowadays? Last time I checked the title is still Detective Conan not Detective Sera XD
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Re: Why do people dislike Ran?

Post by AICHAN »

magnolia88 wrote:It's funny if the topic changed from "Why people dislike Ran" into "
I cant stand sticking with DC for years if not because of Haibara and Black org. Even the cases dont interest me much again.

Am I the only one who wondering why Gosho has focused into Sera's family nowadays? Last time I checked the title is still Detective Conan not Detective Sera XD
LOL I feel the same!I only read DC because of Haibara and the BO,the cases are becoming repetitives,the characters don't change through the story,except Ai and maybe Vermouth.
And concerning Sera well I agree with you,even if she's an important character I have the feeling we see her too much...I can't really appreciate Sera as a character because I feel like Gosho forces us to like her.She almost has no flaws,which reminds me of Ran,so it's also making her unrealistic IMO.But as long as the plot is moving,I won't complain XDXD.And I always liked Akai so knowing about his family isn't a problem for me.

@mamato:I know Shinichi disappeared for only several months in DC timeline,but real people can change in a few months when something big happens in their life,even little changes are good to see.But Ran(and also Shinichi)doesn't change from the beginning.Anyway she's still OK as a character,but not exceptional.
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Re: Why do people dislike Ran?

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kirite wrote:Ayumi and Ai does the cooking while the rest of the DB play games.
Doesn't Haibara usually mess around on a computer while Ayumi plays with everyone else? I know what case you're refering to, but I don't think that's the majority.
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Re: Why do people dislike Ran?

Post by n.hoangphu15 »

IMO i don't hate her at all. I mean what she does is what the author want her to. I just wonder why Gosho doesn't let her play bigger role in DC. She's the second main character and yet she doesn't have any specific moment for her own. I don't understand the intention of Gosho, making her the second main character but keeping her from REALLY BEING the main character. Just doesn't seem fair for Ran at all! I hope there will be a way to make Gosho change his mind. *I will write a private letter to Ghoso to tell him my opinion if i know the adress!!* muahhhhhh hahahahhaha.
LET RAN HAVE BIGGER ROLE IN DC PLZZZZZZZZZZZZ GOSHOOOOOOO
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Re: Why do people dislike Ran?

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n.hoangphu15 wrote:IMO i don't hate her at all. I mean what she does is what the author want her to. I just wonder why Gosho doesn't let her play bigger role in DC. She's the second main character and yet she doesn't have any specific moment for her own. I don't understand the intention of Gosho, making her the second main character but keeping her from REALLY BEING the main character. Just doesn't seem fair for Ran at all! I hope there will be a way to make Gosho change his mind. *I will write a private letter to Ghoso to tell him my opinion if i know the adress!!* muahhhhhh hahahahhaha.
LET RAN HAVE BIGGER ROLE IN DC PLZZZZZZZZZZZZ GOSHOOOOOOO
(Rubbing salts on your wounds intentionally because the capital word and the red color you used make my eyes itched fufufu :3)
In my opinion, Gosho created Ran to be main protagonist's lover. Unfortunately, her character has dragged so much so he needs to create her awesomeness to calm down some Ran's fans. She needs to steal back Ai's spotlight because Ai is not main character. So Ran seems to be force out not to be herself anymore. She has potential to be a great character eventually. My thoughts that she will be guessing Shinichi's identity at last.
On the other hand Ai Haibara, She is a character to enhance the progress and everything related with BO must been through her.
And not to mention, Sera has stolen Ran's awesomeness now :P (im not neither she nor Ran fans, I just accepted her to be there)
What do you expect Ran having a bigger role? Gosho has mentioned that something will be happening in Ran's 17th birthday. You can expect a kiss after 20 years(hehehe).
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Re: Why do people dislike Ran?

Post by mamato »

In my opinion, Gosho created Ran to be main protagonist's lover
That is not true, because if Gosho created Ran only to be lover of Shinichi, then would not partecipate the plot principal.

And i don't think neither that Sera stolen Ran awesomeness, because i'm sure that Sera will be important only for this arc, while Ran is important for all Dc
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Re: Why do people dislike Ran?

Post by magnolia88 »

mamato wrote:
In my opinion, Gosho created Ran to be main protagonist's lover
That is not true, because if Gosho created Ran only to be lover of Shinichi, then would not partecipate the plot principal.

And i don't think neither that Sera stolen Ran awesomeness, because i'm sure that Sera will be important only for this arc, while Ran is important for all Dc
Well, i believe Ran to be created to be Shinichi's lover at first. During the progress, people want her not be a damsell in distress, so Gosho dig out her relationship with Shinichi more deeper, her friendship with Kazuha and Sonoko and the important one, her interaction with Ai. A coincidence that Akemi' resemblance is similar with Ran? No, Gosho is a troll :/ he made it on purpose.

Gosho had planned to introduce Ai first than Heiji. But the editor wanted to make a rivalry detective so Heiji popped out. He makes Ai's character opposed with Ran's. I can see he was surprised Ai has stolen everyone's attention so he put Ai among Detective boys. And not to mention, a triangle classiclove story although Gosho seems love to torture her( Ai has lost everyone dearly in her life. Make her falling in love with main male chatacter in unrequited way is the meanest) and Im glad because he has dropped the triangle idea.

Sera is the important character since Ai. Gosho himself stated it. I dont think Sera will be out of picture like Eisuke.
You can see her popularity increased and she became the third position for favorite female after Ai and Ran.
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Re: Why do people dislike Ran?

Post by mamato »

Well, i believe Ran to be created to be Shinichi's lover at first. During the progress, people want her not be a damsell in distress, so Gosho dig out her relationship with Shinichi more deeper, her friendship with Kazuha and Sonoko and the important one, her interaction with Ai. A coincidence that Akemi' resemblance is similar with Ran? No, Gosho is a troll :/ he made it on purpose.
Sorry but i don't think was a request of fan to let Ran in a plot principal, it was a idea of Goshi from the beginning. And then Ran has never been damsel in distress (That happened in fillers, movies, opening and ending that's not canon) because is always Ran that saved Shinichi when he's close the death, for example when Shinichi have a fight with kidnapper of Akiko Tani in volume 1 and Ran save he.

But Ran not save only Shinichi, she save even herself, indeed as like Snoci said, when a criminal attacks Ran, Kogoro and Conan are always worry for the criminal not for Ran like happened for example in the case of watchs in volume 17 :D
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Re: Why do people dislike Ran?

Post by usotsuki »

Or like her and Kazuha when the killer tried to charge them in ep.651, and Conan and Heiji are both like "I wouldn't do that if I were you..." ?
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