Arrow/The Flash (The CW Series)

[Akonyl]

yeah, I get that it's good if a protag isn't perfect, but in this case it's not just like "oh it's a character flaw I do it by accident", it's him actively manipulating people. He's pretty much Light from Death Note, except in DN they didn't really try to make you think he was a good guy.

also, something I have a huge beef with, is his "it was all part of the plan" line, for similar reasons:

Spoiler: Because this is a little more in depth so it might be spoilery

It's understandable that he would need to get in a situation where he had an airtight alibi while the Hood was seen elsewhere, it was pretty evident since the first episode. However, the way that he went about it is completely unpredictable and could never have been part of the plan.

Such a plan would necessitate a partner to be "The Hood" elsewhere while he was cooped up, and at the time when he dropped evidence to the cops by letting himself be seen on the camera which he "knew was there", he was completely alone and had no such partner. The only reason Diggle was even introduced to him as the Hood is because Diggle was drawn into the line of fire against a trained assassin who uses deadly poison bullets. For this to all be part of the plan would mean that when Oliver got caught on camera, he had already decided that he would have a partner by the time the police got to the footage (so, ASAP). Which means that what happened to Diggle- getting shot with a deadly poisoned bullet from a trained assassin- was planned too? Because if so that makes him even more evil.

But, let's say that if Diggle hadn't been shot, Oliver would've just told him "Hey Diggle guess what I'm the Hood!" anyway. Even assuming that, if Diggle hadn't agreed to his plans in the end, his "plan" would be completely screwed too. Good thing he played the "dead brother" card on Diggle to make sure he'd say "yes". :V

So I mean, while the main character pulling a Death Note "JUST AS PLANNED!" moment is cool and all, it's really not that great when the only way for that to be possible is if it means the character's even more of a manipulative asshole than he lets on, who possibly intentionally pulls other innocent people into harm's way.


I actually think it would have just been a lot better had Diggle never agreed at the end of the previous episode, and have it be that Oliver hadn't planned to get arrested at all, and had just gotten swept up in the heat of "playing the hero" and let evidence slip by accident. Then, Diggle would come to his own conclusion (completely independent of Oliver's manipulation) and don the Hood of his own volition to provide Oliver with an alibi, saving the need for Oliver to act like a complete ass to everyone in his life during this episode and basically assassinate his character in the process.

[Conan-chandesune]

yeah, I get that it's good if a protag isn't perfect, but in this case it's not just like "oh it's a character flaw I do it by accident", it's him actively manipulating people. He's pretty much Light from Death Note, except in DN they didn't really try to make you think he was a good guy.

also, something I have a huge beef with, is his "it was all part of the plan" line, for similar reasons:

Spoiler: Because this is a little more in depth so it might be spoilery

It's understandable that he would need to get in a situation where he had an airtight alibi while the Hood was seen elsewhere, it was pretty evident since the first episode. However, the way that he went about it is completely unpredictable and could never have been part of the plan.

Such a plan would necessitate a partner to be "The Hood" elsewhere while he was cooped up, and at the time when he dropped evidence to the cops by letting himself be seen on the camera which he "knew was there", he was completely alone and had no such partner. The only reason Diggle was even introduced to him as the Hood is because Diggle was drawn into the line of fire against a trained assassin who uses deadly poison bullets. For this to all be part of the plan would mean that when Oliver got caught on camera, he had already decided that he would have a partner by the time the police got to the footage (so, ASAP). Which means that what happened to Diggle- getting shot with a deadly poisoned bullet from a trained assassin- was planned too? Because if so that makes him even more evil.

But, let's say that if Diggle hadn't been shot, Oliver would've just told him "Hey Diggle guess what I'm the Hood!" anyway. Even assuming that, if Diggle hadn't agreed to his plans in the end, his "plan" would be completely screwed too. Good thing he played the "dead brother" card on Diggle to make sure he'd say "yes". :V

So I mean, while the main character pulling a Death Note "JUST AS PLANNED!" moment is cool and all, it's really not that great when the only way for that to be possible is if it means the character's even more of a manipulative asshole than he lets on, who possibly intentionally pulls other innocent people into harm's way.


I actually think it would have just been a lot better had Diggle never agreed at the end of the previous episode, and have it be that Oliver hadn't planned to get arrested at all, and had just gotten swept up in the heat of "playing the hero" and let evidence slip by accident. Then, Diggle would come to his own conclusion (completely independent of Oliver's manipulation) and don the Hood of his own volition to provide Oliver with an alibi, saving the need for Oliver to act like a complete ass to everyone in his life during this episode and basically assassinate his character in the process.

But you forgot one thing - Yagami light was AWESOME! i dont know about you, but i loved such a manipulative, nuanced character. Also, in the 2nd episode only, Diggle had started to figure it out, so Ollie would've told him eventually. Either way, now the wait begins for

Spoiler:

THE HUNTRESS

[Akonyl]

But you forgot one thing - Yagami light was AWESOME! i dont know about you, but i loved such a manipulative, nuanced character.

there's a big difference though between Oliver and Light though, in that Light was painted as an evil genius and nothing but, while this show attempts to paint Oliver as a somewhat sympathetic character through his romantic and family plotlines.

I don't have an issue with having a main character that's blatantly evil (after all, villains can be cool), but I have one when the show's treatment of the character is so schizophrenic. In one moment they show Oliver being a horrible human being, and then in the next moment, they show him as this completely relatable dude who wants to make things right with his family and his ex-girlfriend. It's like they expect you to forget everything else he's done, just while you're watching those moments.

[Conan-chandesune]

But you forgot one thing - Yagami light was AWESOME! i dont know about you, but i loved such a manipulative, nuanced character.

there's a big difference though between Oliver and Light though, in that Light was painted as an evil genius and nothing but, while this show attempts to paint Oliver as a somewhat sympathetic character through his romantic and family plotlines.

I don't have an issue with having a main character that's blatantly evil (after all, villains can be cool), but I have one when the show's treatment of the character is so schizophrenic. In one moment they show Oliver being a horrible human being, and then in the next moment, they show him as this completely relatable dude who wants to make things right with his family and his ex-girlfriend. It's like they expect you to forget everything else he's done, just while you're watching those moments.

I dont feel that i HAVE to sympathize with the character and that is the show's... depiction, which is obviously, partial. As well as interpretations of Ollie's behaviour by the characters like Laurel seem biased cuz she doesnt know the truth. In either case, Bring on the fishnets!!!!!

[Conan-chandesune]

For those who want to know more about the show, can pick up the digital series written by marc guggenheim, the same writer as that of the show. The first one is a bit boring as it repeats over ep 2's end but the others offer valuable insight.

[Conan-chandesune]

The latest episode was a bit weaker than the previous ones.... featuring Guggenheim's take on

Spoiler:

The Royal Flush Gang

[MaitreDétective]

Saw the first episode today. Made me want to watch the rest

[Conan-chandesune]

I loved the Huntress this week.. even though i had doubts Johns pulled it off well.... Exceptional episode.

[Akonyl]

MS Surface tablets making the rounds on TV, it seems 

[Conan-chandesune]

MS Surface tablets making the rounds on TV, it seems 

Yup, first elementary , then miss smoak...... Year's end will be much more interesting to you if you are not a reader of the comics.

[Moriarty]

In last week's episode, Vendetta, there was a character named Anthony Venza. I personally know the actor who played him. He was on the swim team with my uncle, when they were in high school.

[Conan-chandesune]

Re-Arrowed up after seeing the coming influx of characters. For those with the knowledge of the comics,

Spoiler:

Roy Harper, Firefly, Count Vertigo

http://www.tvguide.com/News/Arrow-Colto ... 57668.aspx

[Conan-chandesune]

Did you vote for arrow at the people's choice awards? Cuz i did!

[Jecka]

Holy crap, I am so behind...

[Conan-chandesune]

A bit of sad news. A spokesperson for DC confirmed that no Bats on Arrow.