Forum reserved for discussing specific points of the story—mostly from the manga. Be warned, these discussions will be current with the manga and will spoil many plot lines for anime-centric fans.
Pocky wrote:
What believe is, he's going to join the organization because Gin thinks he's dead. He probably might not reconize him.
In one of the episodes, he says, "I forget the faces of those who died."
I don't know what he's going to do next.
Actually, doesn't he say "I don't remember the face of those who I've killed"?
If it's so, he would recognize him right away since he was able to see through Vermouth's disguise in one of the episodes when she was serving them martini while she was disguised as a male waiter.
Yep, I think Gin would smell Akai even if he was to disguise
Pocky wrote:
What believe is, he's going to join the organization because Gin thinks he's dead. He probably might not reconize him.
In one of the episodes, he says, "I forget the faces of those who died."
I don't know what he's going to do next.
Actually, doesn't he say "I don't remember the face of those who I've killed"?
If it's so, he would recognize him right away since he was able to see through Vermouth's disguise in one of the episodes when she was serving them martini while she was disguised as a male waiter.
Yes but, There's also another way to put that. (: Gin BELIEVES that akai's dead from the scene at Raiha falls. So Gin doesn't not remember his face anymore. He forgets his face before he changes into disguise.
Therefore, he can disguise all he wants. :]
Also, "I" could be the black organization as a whole, it doesn't mean just him. It could mean the whole organization.
Last edited by Pocky on August 13th, 2008, 3:32 pm, edited 1 time in total.
I don't think so. Logically, he forgets those faces because he has killed a lot of people and couldn't remember everyone he has killed (it's not some sort of amnesia, anyway). However, he'd remember someone who is a major threat to the org (like I said, he doesn't have a mental disorder).
It's just like a sport where you don't exactly remember the people you easily defeated but you remember those who beat you or put you into a tough spot.
He'd just probably lower down his guard and think less of the possibility that Akai is alive, so Akai can sneak in freely.
yume_no_meitantei wrote:
I don't think so. Logically, he forgets those faces because he has killed a lot of people and couldn't remember everyone he has killed (it's not some sort of amnesia, anyway). However, he'd remember someone who is a major threat to the org (like I said, he doesn't have a mental disorder).
It's just like a sport where you don't exactly remember the people you easily defeated but you remember those who beat you or put you into a tough spot.
He'd just probably lower down his guard and think less of the possibility that Akai is alive, so Akai can sneak in freely.
Perhaps Gin purposely or instinctively forgets the people he killed (both names and faces) to escape the guilt of killing them. (Or in Akai's case: ordering their deaths)
Of course this is mostly speculation, unlike Vermouth there is currently too little material on Gin to make a comprehensive assessment.
Last edited by Quiet Lurker on August 14th, 2008, 3:29 am, edited 1 time in total.
Quiet Lurker wrote:
Perhaps Gin purposely or instinctively forgets the people he killed (both names and faces) to escape the guilt of killing them. (Or in Akai's case: ordering their deaths)
You think Gin is affected by guilt? IMOO, him forgetting the faces of his victims is a sign of his insensitiveness and it really gives him a "killer aura", just like what Shinichi saw in Gin's eyes
You claimed that it is illogical for Gin to forget his victims, I gave an explanation.
As I said, Gin is not burdened by guilt because he forgets EVERYONE he killed. Forgetting his victims is PRECISELY the reason why Gin is ABLE to kill again and again without remorse. (i.e. He is quickly able to dehumanize his victims into statistics)
I'm just confused why you said "escape the guilt of killing them" term. What I understood from that was that he had a struggle to overcome some sort of "guilt" he had inside him And I think the forgetfulness is sort of instinctive/unconscious of him, though I believe his emotionlessness is the main factor that made him a mass killer.
Pocky wrote:
But... Quiet Lurker, "A single death is a tragedy; a million deaths is a statistic." ther person who said that clearly isn't Gin right?
Yeah, but he seems to point out that the saying goes with Gin too.
yume_no_meitantei wrote:
I'm just confused why you said "escape the guilt of killing them" term. What I understood from that was that he had a struggle to overcome some sort of "guilt" he had inside him And I think the forgetfulness is sort of instinctive/unconscious of him, though I believe his emotionlessness is the main factor that made him a mass killer.
And I think the forgetfulness is sort of instinctive/unconscious of him, though I believe his emotionlessness is the main factor that made him a mass killer:
Yup, and that is backed up by what Shinichi said.
it's ridiculous that eisuke's akai in disguise. eisuke and akai are 2 completely different people. eisuke is eisuke. a little clumsy transferred student, who thinks even a chan-ken-po (paper-rock-scissor game) is against him. he can be as deductive as conan if he wanted to, and to only a small number of people he show what he's capable of. like the case, conan in vol 60, the chapter before the BO's bourbon got brought up. think of this way: why would even eisuke, the akai in disguise, keep saying he'll end up to cia? akai isn't vermouth. he's not even in the cia, so why was he constantly bringing up cia this, cia that? akai is a FBI agent, he's, i mean was, devoted to his job.
conan sort of revealed his identity to eisuke was because he trusted him, and knew he would end up like his sister, rena, being a cia agent. maybe not as a double agent like rena, but would help him bring down the BO. he need more alias in order to do that. that include FBI, hattori, possibly KID, hakuba, and cia (that's eisuke and rena).
eisuke, in return, he revealed how he suspected conan, and bring up akai's death. the last conversation they shared only proved conan's suspicion to be true that akai is dead. and that only to have him stand on his ground more firmly that he's GOING to take down the BO. the BO had took one good guy down, but didn't mean that he would coward away. he lost one guy, but he knew sometime in the future, he'll another helping hand, and that is eisuke. the cia future-to-be.
the smirk on conan's face conveyed that he knew eisuke how clever he, eisuke, wanted to be if he want, or had an institution that would aim them biting down the BO. it just isn't about luck that conan need, he would also need some helping hand and institution.
and okiya, i'm pretty sure he's one of the BO member, and bourbon is his code name.
