Shinichi+Ran

[soratothamax]

I don´t like ShinRan cause Shinichi only got the resolution to confess to Ran AFTER she confessed her love to Conan unknowingly that he´s Shinichi.
Before that he only dreamed about it with him in the role as the always-cool lover who responds to her love-sick confession (like every other teenager do dream ´bout it XD), but didn´t do anything to get their (Ran did thought it wasn´t that much (cause Shinichi turned too fast into Conan) it was way more then Shinichi did ).

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But for now - HAPPY NEW YEAR - we have 2 years before we die, let's make the most of this year and next xD

Sadly, you're right. And it is so common in almost all Shonens it's sickening. That's because Japan still has an old view of women and relationships (marry young while you still can, and marry overly caring, sensitive, and motherly type of women, and oh, they have to be beautiful) when most people at that age make poor decisions in love and in choosing partners because the teen years are when emotions and feelings are most misunderstood.

I really thought their relationship seemed ridiculous and elementary in the latest volume. How does Ran not kick butt just because she thinks Shinichi won't like it? That's the most retarded thing ever. You will get your friend killed to impress Shinichi who isn't even around? What seems more trivial? Shinichi or someone's life? That just goes to show how immature she is. Forget him, YOUR FREAKING FRIEND WAS IN DANGER! just a dumb broad!

At least I used to see that she would care for people enough to save them, but now she lets Shinichi run her whole life like she doesn't have one of her own. That's ridiculous.

It's called love, people. It makes people think irrationally and do stupid, stupid things. Not a common experience among manga otaku, I take it?

That's called inexperienced love. If it was REAL love she'd be far more confident in who she is and would expect Shinichi to like her for who she is. She would expect him to understand her.

Ran went by a dumb machine to see the type of girl Shinichi would like. That is elementary.

I really think that Ran just has a crush on Shinichi, which is different from loving him. I really think he just has a crush on her. I'm not interested in crushes. I'm interested in complex relationships. I'm more interested in Gin/Shiho's relationships than Ran and Shinichi's crush on one another.

[soratothamax]

Sadly, you're right. And it is so common in almost all Shonens it's sickening. That's because Japan still has an old view of women and relationships (marry young while you still can, and marry overly caring, sensitive, and motherly type of women, and oh, they have to be beautiful) when most people at that age make poor decisions in love and in choosing partners because the teen years are when emotions and feelings are most misunderstood.

Ahh from reading this I can tell Sora is back <3 (though you have been back in a while, I guess I haven't been on forums that much).  I hope you read this thread once in a blue moon.  Miss you lots.  Have you read any good Josei or Seinen manga?

Let's not be (too) feminist here.  In real life I don't think typical Japanese guys have this view on girls.  Plus in real life girls can also have painfully shallow views on guys yes?  Plus from my experience Japanese guy view is more like marry late (they don't like to get married), marry a women with university degree that can earn a good income but lets you boss her around anyways (so really, it's worse then what you said). 

Now actually on topic-ish, Ran.  Her friend wasn't in danger, she just wanted Ran to stop a purse snatcher from running away.  Plus in real circumstances Ran can be charged if she Karate's the guy's ass like she usually does.  Now if some guy was threatening to hurt Sonoko (which always happens) she'll kick the guy's ass for sure.

Ran was just scared Shinichi doesn't like her (with him always hinting he has something to say to her and all). I don't see what the problem is with that, she's at a festival with her friends and family, can't a girl have a moment to think about silly things?  Plus I don't agree that people are only stupid with love when they're teens.  People are stupid with love no matter how old they are.  You can never be mature enough to be in love even if you're 20, 30, 40, 50.  As you grow older, you realise people just don't grow up.

-----

It's called love, people. It makes people think irrationally and do stupid, stupid things.

mangaluva is right
the definition of love is give the life for the other so Shinichi tries to make Ran not to suffer for not telling what happen
so if Ran is in danger is gonna save her even if he dies

Spoiler:

but of course we don't want that to happen

Well he doesn't want her to suffer.  That won't stop her from dying from being unknowingly surrounded by FBI, CIA, BO, murderers who all carry guns and shiney knife thingys.  Sometimes you got to realise you can't do everything for the ones you care about (though this IS a shounen manga, so of course Shinichi can save the day if it comes to that lol).  Plus Ran confess she loves him doesn't she, so she'll want to protect as much as he wants to protect her.  So if he doesn't want HER keeping secrets from him (which she already is with the Vermouth thing) then he better start telling the truth.   

And yes, it is good to be back. 

To me, these type of threads would be boring without someone disagreeing. There wouldn't be more than 1 page. This is a discussion thread, so I am discussing my Ran/Shin view.

In the manga file

Spoiler:

the man took out a knife and put it to Sonoko and she relented and he snatched her purse. Ran decided not do anything about it because a machine said Shinichi wouldn't like it. Does that sound mature to you, or logical for that matter?

Stupidity in love only comes when you are SURE the person even loves you back. A machine can't tell you if a person loves you or not. It's sad that people in their 20s, 30s, and 40s still don't get that concept. Maybe that's why there are so many divorces and the rates of divorce are high because people are so stupid.

Aside, I'm an old-time fan. But unlike most old-time fans, I am bored with Shin/Ran. I find them very elementary and uninteresting. I think that Ran/Shin are very physical. They are only going by looks (which is evident by Shin's reaction) but not just by looks but by the fact that they have nothing in common aside from the fact they grew up together. Just because you grow up with someone doesn't mean you know them more neither does it mean they are good for you. Like I've said before, you can be in a room with a person for one hour, and not speak, so you won''t know one another. And then two other people get in the room for 1 minute and talk, and know everything about one another. It's quality in relationships, not quantity. Ran/Shin seem like quantity, or better yet, a crush. They are not even on the same page intellectually, let alone emotionally, or financially (his career requires two incomes to survive, and all she's good at is being a housewife). They are not compatible. PURE love often isn't realistic. But you're right, this is Shonen, not for ADULTS but kids. And in shonens the most impossible is possible.

It's sad. But I see promise in other relationships like Takagi/Sato and Ai/ConanShiho/Shin because they have substance. They make the story interesting at least. Though I might like Ai and Conan more as friends, I like their relationship a lot better than Shin/Ran's so-called "romance."

I think DC is far too unique of a shonen manga/anime to not have a unique romance. IMO 

[Abs.]

In the manga file

Spoiler:

the man took out a knife and put it to Sonoko and she relented and he snatched her purse. Ran decided not do anything about it because a machine said Shinichi wouldn't like it. Does that sound mature to you, or logical for that matter?

Wait, what manga file were you reading?  In my manga file,

Spoiler:

the man used the knife to cut Sonoko's purse strap, not threaten her.

They are not even on the same page intellectually, let alone emotionally, or financially (his career requires two incomes to survive, and all she's good at is being a housewife).

How does his career "require two incomes to survive"?  Kogorou seemed to do fine on just half of one income if you take it from the beginning where he hadn't had a case in half a year...  Unless Eri is paying alimony...

But you're right, this is Shonen, not for ADULTS but kids. And in shonens the most impossible is possible.

Isn't it sad, then, that kids are being conditioned into looking for something that doesn't exist?

[Misztina]

EDIT: Boy, this is long, be prepared!

Stupidity in love only comes when you are SURE the person even loves you back.

Lol, I cannot agree with that, since I did experience this, and now I feel awfully stupid about it. Though I was only 15-16-ish. I wanted him to love me and oh the things I have done. Damn, they never really worked out.  hate superstitions for that. XD;;

Maybe the world did change tha much that Ran (in this case me too XD) are a bit outdated and not so mature as teens are nowdays. But you must consider Gosho's vision of a 17 year-old. Believe me, 15 years ago, when the mana started, even 5-6 years ago, and even today there are parts of the world, parts of society where girls are like this. You cannot always expect that for example Ran would be like a girl from the neighbourhood, she "lives" in Japan, in Tokyo or rather in Gosho's mind.

A machine can't tell you if a person loves you or not. It's sad that people in their 20s, 30s, and 40s still don't get that concept. Maybe that's why there are so many divorces and the rates of divorce are high because people are so stupid.

People tend to believe that there is some sort of destiny, which work through mashines. ^^

Aside, I'm an old-time fan. But unlike most old-time fans, I am bored with Shin/Ran. I find them very elementary and uninteresting. I think that Ran/Shin are very physical. They are only going by looks (which is evident by Shin's reaction) but not just by looks but by the fact that they have nothing in common aside from the fact they grew up together. Just because you grow up with someone doesn't mean you know them more neither does it mean they are good for you. Like I've said before, you can be in a room with a person for one hour, and not speak, so you won''t know one another. And then two other people get in the room for 1 minute and talk, and know everything about one another. It's quality in relationships, not quantity. Ran/Shin seem like quantity, or better yet, a crush. They are not even on the same page intellectually, let alone emotionally, or financially (his career requires two incomes to survive, and all she's good at is being a housewife). They are not compatible.

Don't forget that Shinichi has a "crush" for Ran for nearly 4 years by now, I can hardly believe that he hadn't met any cuter, more beautiful or smarter girls, especially if he was abroad by his parents too. Of course they spent together lots of time, almost on a sibling (or cousin) level. Since Shinichi spent so much time with her even after falling in love /crush on her he had enough time to consider whether she is the right one or not. He saw her faults, her virtues and other things.

Ran on the other hand became aware of her feelings towards him (aka. realizing Shinichi is more than a childhood friend) only in the Golden Apple case, 1 year before today's story. Since she hasn't looked at Shinichi with "those" eyes for long I think we may accept that she doesn't think of him as we would like her to. Like Ran doesn't believe that Shinichi would rescue her. I was always startled by this statement of hers, but I guess Shinichi was too shy *huggles him for being cute* to give away himself so he played the cool guy in front of her, as if he wasn't carring for her at all.

Their relationship would be far more interesting if Gosho would dare to go deeper in the shojo field and it contans several aspects which could be played out later in this story.

PURE love often isn't realistic. But you're right, this is Shonen, not for ADULTS but kids. And in shonens the most impossible is possible.
It's sad.

But it can still happen, right?  ;D Don't give up the hope!
This is not real shounen. A real shounen manga wouldn't even deal with this love issues, except for comical use (see: One Piece). We are lucky that Shounen Sunday provides these semi-shounens with some "love" in them, like Inuyasha, Ranma 1/2, Zettai Karen Children too.
Sometimes I wish for an additional shoujo version of DC besides this one. ^^

But I see promise in other relationships like Takagi/Sato and Ai/ConanShiho/Shin because they have substance. They make the story interesting at least. Though I might like Ai and Conan more as friends, I like their relationship a lot better than Shin/Ran's so-called "romance."

Because they develop right in front of your eyes. But you shoul also see that ShinichixRan romance is the base, the standard of the whole story itself. It comes off boring, because unfortunately too less time is given to them and everyone already knows that their relationship will be okay no matter what.
As for ShinichixShiho, it is more exciting, because Ai is a fresh character besides Ran and I think she seems to be far more interesting than Ran in many aspects. If Shinichi wouldn't love Ran as much as he does, he definitely would have taken a real notice of Haibara and would intentionally flirt with her. The fact that he doesn't do this and acts like her friend gives the conclusion that fo him Ran is still more interesting as a "love interest". I mean, really, Haibara looks fascinating, cute and mysterious (even more for a detective), yet she cannot even as we say in hungary "kick in the ball" when it comes to love.
Takagi and Sato are adults, not too naive and have more experiences than the kids. Sato has her anxieties, her lost men, her feelngs to not to fall in love, and Takagi has to fight for the most popular woman in the police, and his rivals are truly fearsome. XD

I think DC is far too unique of a shonen manga/anime to not have a unique romance. IMO  ;D

Agreed. More ShinxRan moments. wait... more meaningful and cute ShinxRan moments for the world!!!  ;D

[kholoudsafir]

Stupidity in love only comes when you are SURE the person even loves you back. A machine can't tell you if a person loves you or not. It's sad that people in their 20s, 30s, and 40s still don't get that concept. Maybe that's why there are so many divorces and the rates of divorce are high because people are so stupid.

Aside, I'm an old-time fan. But unlike most old-time fans, I am bored with Shin/Ran. I find them very elementary and uninteresting. I think that Ran/Shin are very physical. They are only going by looks (which is evident by Shin's reaction) but not just by looks but by the fact that they have nothing in common aside from the fact they grew up together. Just because you grow up with someone doesn't mean you know them more neither does it mean they are good for you. Like I've said before, you can be in a room with a person for one hour, and not speak, so you won''t know one another. And then two other people get in the room for 1 minute and talk, and know everything about one another. It's quality in relationships, not quantity. Ran/Shin seem like quantity, or better yet, a crush. They are not even on the same page intellectually, let alone emotionally, or financially (his career requires two incomes to survive, and all she's good at is being a housewife). They are not compatible. PURE love often isn't realistic. But you're right, this is Shonen, not for ADULTS but kids. And in shonens the most impossible is possible.

It's sad. But I see promise in other relationships like Takagi/Sato and Ai/ConanShiho/Shin because they have substance. They make the story interesting at least. Though I might like Ai and Conan more as friends, I like their relationship a lot better than Shin/Ran's so-called "romance."

I think DC is far too unique of a shonen manga/anime to not have a unique romance. IMO 

[/quote]

It is obvious that we disagree, each person is different. I am not going to argue, because there is nothing to argue about, movie 4 (specially the confession part  ) and ep.270 says it all.

I am going to argue about that calling Ran and Shinchi relationship a 'romance', which I do not think it is, because romance does not last with time, but love does last, because it includes living HARDSHIPS as well as good times.

Also, what kind of romance is that, when the couples are not talking about their love or expressing it openly, at least between EACH OTHERS.

On the other hand  I agree with u on some points, Ran is not sure about his feelings, which makes them interesting couple, because the romance is ONLY being seen by US, the VIEWERS, Ran is just not aware of his feelings.
On the other hand, Shinchi, specially showed an interest in Ran's look or body, may be because he is a boy, which is a typical thing, but his love to her was NOT based on that (movie 7, telling Heiji the story about his meeting with Ran, and ' the first love' episode, Shinchi has explained why he loves Ran)

I am surprised how you see Takagi/Sato with a promised relationship, but not Shinchi and Ran Takagi and Sato started off with a similar thing of HIDDEN feelings, but did not their relationship become less exciting after having the first kiss  , I also, like those two 

[Abs.]

For future reference, any "evidence" coming from the movies or anime original episodes (though 270 is fine) does not count as canon, and can not be taken seriously.

[TheBlind]

This last page has been so,so, so beautiful. Intellectual discussions like these is why I come here, lets you see the series from a different perspective.

[soratothamax]

In the manga file

Spoiler:

the man took out a knife and put it to Sonoko and she relented and he snatched her purse. Ran decided not do anything about it because a machine said Shinichi wouldn't like it. Does that sound mature to you, or logical for that matter?

Wait, what manga file were you reading?  In my manga file,

Spoiler:

the man used the knife to cut Sonoko's purse strap, not threaten her.

They are not even on the same page intellectually, let alone emotionally, or financially (his career requires two incomes to survive, and all she's good at is being a housewife).

How does his career "require two incomes to survive"?  Kogorou seemed to do fine on just half of one income if you take it from the beginning where he hadn't had a case in half a year...  Unless Eri is paying alimony...

But you're right, this is Shonen, not for ADULTS but kids. And in shonens the most impossible is possible.

Isn't it sad, then, that kids are being conditioned into looking for something that doesn't exist?

Detectives fluctuate in incomes, sometimes they do very good, and sometimes they do bad, I've worked in that field and trust me, it's hard to keep a budget. They also have the highest divorce rates....

Also, in the manga, if a weapon is involved that is a THREAT. She was lucky that it was just her purse, it could've been her arm or stomach if she had turned the wrong way. That's still threatening her with a knife and it could've been her life. It really could've been. And another man was going to be hurt, and Ran stood there like an idiot. If they had been much meaner, they would've killed them both.

And yes, it's sad, but then again, so is murder and other elements to detective conan that shouldn't exist.

@Misztina Well, machines don't usually work and are usually not accurate either...and I'm sorry to say this but, you know from experience that superstitions don't work...because you wanted someone to love you. Well, I'm telling you, that's a common thing, but I don't think it's always the best course of action, especially when it deals with love. And yes, you're right about those relationships developing. I guess that just seems more adult. Liking someone since childhood often isn't. People can and do change over time. They would need to be a little older for me to take their relationship seriously. I agree that Shojo is interesting sometimes (like CCS, best romance ever!)

@kholoudsafir Hiding has nothing to do with me liking Sato/Takagi. I liked Sato's complex love life the best about it, how she loved Matsuda, but somehow was able to love again. Takagi/Sato are interesting because they are both more similar than most people think. Also, they are both police and have similar professions. They have similar taste in things. They also have on-screen chemistry that isn't a "stereotypical" romance in manga/anime. The girl is tougher than the guy which is strange, but cute and funny. Ran and Shinichi are just too...cliche. Ran is just...fan girl. And Shinichi is eating up that everybody loves him. I think Shiho/Ai is the different girls, who likes behind the shadows, but doesn't blow Shinichi's head up. She's different from the girls he's used to. She's different from all the females in the whole manga! Haibara seems not to love, but really does. And she and Conan share a lot in common, have CAREERS ahead of them, share this crazy world of crime (Haibara understands Shinichi's need to battle crime than Ran does. She just sees that Shinichi is interested in it, but doesn't understand it).

I think that just because Shinichi liked Ran since the beginning and likes her now, doesn't mean he won't gain feelings for another. It is very possible. I mean, it would be obvious that Shin liked Ran since that was his only girl as a friend. But now he is meeting other women. He may find someone else he loves that fits him better, and will be good with him as he matures and life changes for him. He can't erase everything that has happened with the BO and the people he got close to as a result. It will change him. Question is: Will Ran be in love with the new Shinichi? He's not entirely the same guy anymore. Experience changes a person. And meeting new people do too.

Aside from that, I see Ai/Conan as having more television chemistry. They are far more entertaining. Ran and Shin are too sappy for my tastes and too cliche for me to find interest in. The only sappy romance I liked was CCS, and that's because of it's complexity and it showed people that the person you think is least good for you, could be your best bet. Sometimes the people you love aren't always the people that are best for you.

[Schillok]

In the manga file

Spoiler:

the man took out a knife and put it to Sonoko and she relented and he snatched her purse. Ran decided not do anything about it because a machine said Shinichi wouldn't like it. Does that sound mature to you, or logical for that matter?

Wait, what manga file were you reading?  In my manga file,

Spoiler:

the man used the knife to cut Sonoko's purse strap, not threaten her.

They are not even on the same page intellectually, let alone emotionally, or financially (his career requires two incomes to survive, and all she's good at is being a housewife).

Yeah, that's the same as I read. Sonoko wasn't in danger at that time. If she were I am sure Ran would have her priorities right and done anything to save her best friend.

And you can't really blame Ran for believing in the fortune. That's how she is, a bit superstitious.
Additionally... the guy she likes is away for almost one year now and hardly contacts her. She has no idea why he does that but she loves him very much and doesn't want to lose him. If a famous oracle tells her to behave more feminine... it is worth a try, right? It couldn't make the situation any worse.
Because however confident Ran is: There is still that final piece of doubt that it might be because of her that Shinichi left and isn't returning.

Still, her reaction was better than that of the other guests. At least she considered doing something in that situation.

I think that Ran/Shin are very physical. They are only going by looks (which is evident by Shin's reaction) but not just by looks but by the fact that they have nothing in common aside from the fact they grew up together. Just because you grow up with someone doesn't mean you know them more neither does it mean they are good for you. Like I've said before, you can be in a room with a person for one hour, and not speak, so you won''t know one another. And then two other people get in the room for 1 minute and talk, and know everything about one another. It's quality in relationships, not quantity. Ran/Shin seem like quantity, or better yet, a crush. They are not even on the same page intellectually, let alone emotionally, or financially (his career requires two incomes to survive, and all she's good at is being a housewife). They are not compatible. PURE love often isn't realistic.

I really can't agree to this.
Ran and Shinichi have a lot in common. Especially in ethics and ideals.

Spoiler:

I know, DC is full of idealistic people. But would a normal person had tried to help that person? I can say one thing for sure: Shiho wouldn't have.
And it is not about the outer appearance (though Shinichi certainly doesn't mind that Ran is quite good-looking; neither is Ran how cool Shinichi can be sometimes). Shinichi/Conan also likes Ran compassion, friendliness, loyalty and resolve. And he accepts her weaknesses. Ran on the other hand is deeply impressed by Shinichis courage, sense for justice and unwavering confidence.
Intelligence isn't everything. And Ran is not stupid, she is pretty smart actually. It is just that Shinichi is a genius who seems to know EVERYTHING. It is quite similar to Yukiko and Yusaku who - despite occasional quarrels - are a very harmonic couple.
And I think emotional - which is the level of values and ideals - they are very compatible.
Financial... does it really matter? And if it matters: Ran is still young, she wasn't even in college yet. She is smart... basically she still has the potential to become anything she desires. Aside from the money the Kudô family has from Shinichis parents - neither Shinichi nor Ran seem like people who would need a lot of money for their lifestyle anyway.


I guess that "one minute" was symbolic. Because one minute is hardly enough to know anything about a person.
Anyway, love needs quantity. Only by being with your partner for a long time you can understand him completely. It is the opposite: The less time you spent with your love interest, the more likely it is that he/she is just a crush.

Spoiler:

Despite me defending Ran x Shinichi that much... I still think it is quite boring.  ::)

[kirite]

I'm so happy Sora-chan is posting here <3.  Now, if only I can find the KaiShin thread now.  

*Ahem* Anyways, back on topic.

Also, in the manga, if a weapon is involved that is a THREAT. She was lucky that it was just her purse, it could've been her arm or stomach if she had turned the wrong way. That's still threatening her with a knife and it could've been her life. It really could've been. And another man was going to be hurt, and Ran stood there like an idiot. If they had been much meaner, they would've killed them both.

And yes, it's sad, but then again, so is murder and other elements to detective conan that shouldn't exist.

Actually, it's not a matter of people being mean or not.  Last time I checked purse snatchers are out to snatch purses.  Once you hurt or murder someone then you're under a lot of fire.  Someone out to stab random innocent teenagers in a crowded festival street and someone looking to earn quick cash is different I think.  It's true accidents to happen, but the culprit ALREADY snatched Sonoko's purse before heading to Ran's direction.  Sonoko wanted Ran to kick the culprit's ass so she can get her purse back/justice will be served.  Not because she was feeling threatened by the knife wielding culprit (who is heading in Ran's direction by then).  

When you were talking about not protecting people being threatened, I was actually hoping you're talking about the fact that Ran didn't beat up the guys in the alleyway.  Oh well.  To that I would answer the people in the alleyway could be armed so not confronting them and contacting the police would be smarter...and that confronting a group of men in a alleyway alone in the middle of the night is something Shinichi would do.  I wonder if he's influencing her or she influenced him?  Either way they are similar in the way they never mind their own darn business.  

In a way, the first fortune was kinda right.  Shinichi wouldn't want Ran jumping to someone's rescue via epic action sequence.  Though why Ran thinks that's "mannish" conduct I don't really know xD.  What the hell is man-ish conduct anyways?  

Detectives fluctuate in incomes, sometimes they do very good, and sometimes they do bad, I've worked in that field and trust me, it's hard to keep a budget. They also have the highest divorce rates....

(....)

And she and Conan share a lot in common, have CAREERS ahead of them, share this crazy world of crime (Haibara understands Shinichi's need to battle crime than Ran does. She just sees that Shinichi is interested in it, but doesn't understand it).

If detectives fluctuate in income.  Doesn't that mean Shinichi will become a stay at home dad?  You know like his wife will have a full time job and he'll be at home taking care of the kids whenever he doesn't have a case.

*imagines Shinichi cooking and snickers*

Though don't forget that Shinichi isn't your average Detective.  He is a high demand genius detective that's called "savior of the Japanese police force".  I really doubt he'll have problems with income, even if he travels to Hawaii every year to learn random things like riding whales (sorry for not canon).  

And okay, what I don't understand is why would anyone think Shiho would want a carreer in taking down crime? She already spent her entire childhood surrounded by terror and death.  I mean before Ayumi's little speech she doesn't even want anything to do with the B.O. she didn't want Conan to investiage or confront them at all.  I think she'll be much happier doing anything else.  Maybe making pills that make you developed the flu for an hour so you can skip class...  Just like Agasa I think Shiho has a gift in making things.  She'll have more fun making things she likes instead of analysing yet more poisons or being surrounded by yet more dead bodies.

And from what you say.  Does that mean the only people that can fall in love with a detective is another detective? Because you know I like HeiShin for that reason lol.

I think that just because Shinichi liked Ran since the beginning and likes her now, doesn't mean he won't gain feelings for another. It is very possible. I mean, it would be obvious that Shin liked Ran since that was his only girl as a friend. But now he is meeting other women. He may find someone else he loves that fits him better, and will be good with him as he matures and life changes for him. He can't erase everything that has happened with the BO and the people he got close to as a result. It will change him. Question is: Will Ran be in love with the new Shinichi? He's not entirely the same guy anymore. Experience changes a person. And meeting new people do too.

You're right, people change.  Ran was worried about that and Conan comfort her by telling her not to worry, and that he's exactly the same.  You're right that experience change people, but this whole incident is something that they're experiencing together (without her knowing it).  She doesn't know where he is and worries that when he comes back he won't be her best friend/love interest anymore.  However HE knows that he's never left her side so therefore he hasn't grown apart from her.  In fact I think he only started to understand her when he started living with her, he can't see past her Happy Ran face (tm) and only started realising her feelings by pure coincidence.  So happen to walk by the door and listen in on her when she's secretly crying, having Agasa tell him that she's worried about him, the extremely random love confession.  Those are all "discovered" after he became Conan.  You're right that their feelings are "set" at the beginning of the series.  However it takes time for their relationship to grow.  And it is.

(oi oi, we need more AiCon fans in here....*goes look for girl19*)

[TheBlind]

I know, DC is full of idealistic people. But would a normal person had tried to help that person? I can say one thing for sure: Shiho wouldn't have.

No she wouldn't have and neither would any normal person. One behavior all humans have in common is self-preservation. It develops in several ways such as shock/fear to prevent movement, adrenaline to encourage escape, or anger to stimulate fighting with the end result being surviving. You can't ask someone to go against something that is programmed down to the core and overrides logical thinking. The only reason,(I believe) Shinichi can "overcome" his self-preservation is because it never activates. Shinichi is the type to be full of himself, to believe he is always in control and his mind can run several scenarios quickly enough to know by the time his hand pulls up the killer, that he will be ready. That's why Shinichi can live his sense of justice to the letter because he has something to support and back it up(how Gosho intentionally created him) unlike the rest of "normal" people.

As for Ran, I'll play devil's advocate and ask the question, did Ran save the man that just tried to kill her because she is confident in herself to the degree Shinichi is(arguably, no) or is she actually conditioned to act that way because she grew up with Shinichi aka "What would Shinichi do/Shinichi save the day"?
Similar how to the Detective Boys find more confidence in growing and learning around Conan. So couldn't it be said that anyone placed in the role of Shinichi's childhood friend would have the confidence and ideals that Ran exhibits to some extend making her less special?

And I think emotional - which is the level of values and ideals - they are very compatible.
And it is not about the outer appearance (though Shinichi certainly doesn't mind that Ran is quite good-looking; neither is Ran how cool Shinichi can be sometimes). Shinichi/Conan also likes Ran compassion, friendliness, loyalty and resolve. And he accepts her weaknesses.And I think emotional - which is the level of values and ideals - they are very compatible.

To continue my last point, couldn't it be argued that Ran is just a foil for Shinichi?
So all her ideals that you listed are just something she "inherited" from Shinichi by growing up with him. Similar to how a child inherits the ideals of their parent by watching them and learning from the lessons/actions. So if this is the case, the real Ran can just be summed up in the traits that she and Shinichi do not share and that just only leaves a plain High School girl. Then you can go further and say that Shinichi isn't in love with Ran, he's in love with the pieces of himself(arguably, yes because he likes his ego) he sees being projected from her.

This explains why Shinichi has never been dependent on Ran more than Heiji, Agasa, Akai, and Haibara(outside of having someone to make him feel big about himself) because she has never shown him anything that he couldn't find within himself while the same cannot be said for Ran. Instead Ran just acts as something he needs to protect, give confidence, and keep safe from the shadows or in the light.

The recent "Ran thinks of Shinichi" cases do give weight to this argument(even if I dislike it as Ran fan). In the past Ran was so confident in herself and independent from Shinichi that theories like these would be laughed at, not anymore. It seems Gosho's writing of Ran's character has gotten so bad(yes bad, I refuse to believe that this is the true progression of Ran) that he himself has forgotten that Ran was never dependent on Shinichi, but only missed him and wanted to return to a normal lifestyle with him.
...But hey it's his story.

[Abs.]

As for Ran, I'll play devil's advocate and ask the question, did Ran save the man that just tried to kill her because she is confident in herself to the degree Shinichi is(arguably, no) or is she actually conditioned to act that way because she grew up with Shinichi aka "What would Shinichi do/Shinichi save the day"?

Neither of the above.  Ran is abnormal as well in that sense - I believe she saved the "man" because that's just how she is - just as she saved the actress earlier in that case.  She cares about others more than herself - to an extreme degree, perhaps - and to the point of forgetting about her own safety.  (Conan had to tell her about the helmet when she went to save the "first love" senpai from the burning house.)

This is different from Shinichi, who rescues people because he believes he's the only one who can.  Shinichi does it knowing it'll turn out alright for him in the end.

[kholoudsafir]

And from what you say.  Does that mean the only people that can fall in love with a detective is another detective?

I was thinking the same. You do not have to be the same to be a couple or or have the same taste 
Although Ran does not have an exceptional IQ to qualify for a lover or a wife for Shinchi, but in my opinion the mutual moral values is the most important thing a person would look for when want to find a partner for build a family, which Shinchi and Ran share.

On the other hand, Although Shinch is just 17, I think he is capable to see clearly Ran's flaws, but he does not mind them, because he can see other quality things she has, which makes up for the first.

Ai and Conan might be perfect for each others, but Ran and Shinchi complete each others  , because she has some good qualities that he lacks in his character.

[Ran-Fan]

In my opinión, the IQ have nothing to do in the Shin-Ran relationship. Maybe this is not a good example  , but even Watson –who was a very intelligent man- some times look like a foul in Sherlock Holmes novels, but only because  his IQ was compared with Holmes IQ  and that was not a handicap for their relationship.

Beside –and sorry for put such a superficial point - I think that Shinichi and Ran look great together as a couple  because they look like the “maleâ€

[TheBlind]

As for Ran, I'll play devil's advocate and ask the question, did Ran save the man that just tried to kill her because she is confident in herself to the degree Shinichi is(arguably, no) or is she actually conditioned to act that way because she grew up with Shinichi aka "What would Shinichi do/Shinichi save the day"?

Neither of the above.  Ran is abnormal as well in that sense - I believe she saved the "man" because that's just how she is - just as she saved the actress earlier in that case.  She cares about others more than herself - to an extreme degree, perhaps - and to the point of forgetting about her own safety.  (Conan had to tell her about the helmet when she went to save the "first love" senpai from the burning house.)

This is different from Shinichi, who rescues people because he believes he's the only one who can.  Shinichi does it knowing it'll turn out alright for him in the end.

That what I believe also but to argue for the other side(aka Ran haters), couldn't Ran's abnormal behavior be liked to her childhood with Shinichi. Ran places herself in danger at every opportunity to save someone but that isn't "real" due to how we humans are wired, there has to be a reason behind other than a reaction. I use to believe that this reason was Ran's confidence that she could protect someone no matter how bad the situation was, in other words I believed it to be immense confidence in herself that allowed her to do such heroic things. But the previous stories have been drilling that Ran lacks confidence unless Shinichi supports her and would ask herself what he would do in situations that she should be depending on herself.

This makes Ran's past heroic events seem cheap(again, why I ignore current "I need Shinichi" Ran), makes you wonder if every time she jumped into action she just told herself "this is what Shinichi would do" without fulling understanding why Shinichi would do it.
Okay, I'm done playing devil's advocate..starting to feel bad breaking down Ran's character. Time to break out the Gin and Vodka and forget this ever happened....