Discussion Thread: Detective Conan Files 828-830

Forum reserved for discussing specific points of the story—mostly from the manga. Be warned, these discussions will be current with the manga and will spoil many plot lines for anime-centric fans.
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Kor
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Discussion Thread: Detective Conan Files 828-830

Post by Kor »

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NOTICE: Even though we have "Spoiler Free" discussion threads now as well, those threads are SOLELY for those that follow along with DCTP releases. For the time being, in this thread, you still need to use spoiler boxes as prescribed above, until the file in question has been released by DCTP.

Spoiler:
This week's file is apparently brought to you by Coca Cola (or whatever is written on that thing. I suck at reading joint writing)

Also, my prediction was apparently correct  :P
Kor wrote: Now it's a case with Amuro

Next time a case with Sera
Last edited by Kor on September 2nd, 2012, 10:48 am, edited 1 time in total.
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mihai

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Re: Discussion Thread: Detective Conan Files 828+

Post by mihai »

looks like we have the new thread :) looks like people didn't expect the raws today
and yes, you were right Kor,
Spoiler:
there's Sera and no Amuro in the new case. That way Conan can work without watching his back. Also, I'm curious what Sera will think of Kaito and how well she and Conan do against him since Kogoro does nothing and Nakamori just gets trolled during this cases :)
milk_hater

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Re: Discussion Thread: Detective Conan Files 828+

Post by milk_hater »

Spoiler:
Isn't a turtle kinda like a fish? XDDDDDDDD It'd be hilarious if Jirokichi had put actual fish in there as well, not knowing.... XDDDD
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Borealis

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Re: Discussion Thread: Detective Conan Files 828+

Post by Borealis »

milk_hater wrote:
Spoiler:
Isn't a turtle kinda like a fish? XDDDDDDDD It'd be hilarious if Jirokichi had put actual fish in there as well, not knowing.... XDDDD
XDDDD
Spoiler:
I was wondering why they mentioned the explosion at the beginning but then I remembered that a KID- heist was planned on that train.

And the gem is named Blush Mermaid. I had a theory that Pandora was related to mermaids. Maybe it is true!!
*shot by grammar police*

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sonoci
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Re: Discussion Thread: Detective Conan Files 828+

Post by sonoci »

milk_hater wrote:
Spoiler:
Isn't a turtle kinda like a fish? XDDDDDDDD It'd be hilarious if Jirokichi had put actual fish in there as well, not knowing.... XDDDD
Spoiler:
This is where the "favor" comes in. If there are actually fish in there, Kaito's going to get Conan to somehow get it out

:P
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Conan 48:69

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Re: Discussion Thread: Detective Conan Files 828+

Post by Conan 48:69 »

Spoiler:
Sera low-blowed Inspector Nakamori, what a bad kid she is, isn't this a crime for attacking police.

Jirokichi should put in a fish into a fish tank since Kaitou Kid feared fishes, of course Jirokichi don't know Kaitou Kid's weak point.

Kogorou is coming, Amuro is no-show. Hmmm....maybe Kogorou is Vermouth in disguise to investigate Kaitou Kid. Due to Bourbon's proficient in investigation, perception and gathering of information, can't he find out Sherry in Bell Tree Express is actually Kid in disguise.
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secretbeauty101

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Re: Discussion Thread: Detective Conan Files 828+

Post by secretbeauty101 »

Conan 48:69 wrote:
Spoiler:
Sera low-blowed Inspector Nakamori, what a bad kid she is, isn't this a crime for attacking police.

Jirokichi should put in a fish into a fish tank since Kaitou Kid feared fishes, of course Jirokichi don't know Kaitou Kid's weak point.

Kogorou is coming, Amuro is no-show. Hmmm....maybe Kogorou is Vermouth in disguise to investigate Kaitou Kid. Due to Bourbon's proficient in investigation, perception and gathering of information, can't he find out Sherry in Bell Tree Express is actually Kid in disguise.
I don't think Vermouth would go as far as to disguise herself as Kogoro in order to help Amuro. I don't think she would help Amuro that much in his quest to find Sherry or even to investigate Akai's death.  Infact I think Vermouth only disguised as SA in the bell tree express because she knew a confrontation was going on and she wanted in on the action and to make sure Bourbon keeps his promise.

I think this chapter is going to be epic though and I can't wait! :D
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Wakarimashita
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Re: Discussion Thread: Detective Conan Files 828+

Post by Wakarimashita »

Spoiler:
The Sera kicking Nakamori's crown jewels moment was really dumb if not downright ridiculous. Such pathetic humour (it reminded me of movie 14 which isn't a compliment). I was much more fond of Ran stoping Conan from seeing the statue, at least it wasn't as blatantly unsubtle.
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If such an entity really existed, wouldn't all honest, hard-working people be happy?"

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alicetama
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Re: Discussion Thread: Detective Conan Files 828+

Post by alicetama »

Spoiler:
I thought it was hilarious, but, we all have different senses of humor. xD
Btw, what was that statue?
Why? You never win the cursed war.
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Wakarimashita
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Re: Discussion Thread: Detective Conan Files 828+

Post by Wakarimashita »

alicetama wrote:
Spoiler:
I thought it was hilarious, but, we all have different senses of humor. xD
Btw, what was that statue?
Spoiler:
The Aphrodite of Tokyo. ^^
"I wonder if there really is a God...
If such an entity really existed, wouldn't all honest, hard-working people be happy?"

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El Huesudo II
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Re: Discussion Thread: Detective Conan Files 828+

Post by El Huesudo II »

Conan 48:69 wrote:Due to Bourbon's proficient in investigation, perception and gathering of information, can't he find out Sherry in Bell Tree Express is actually Kid in disguise?
Nope.

Investigation, perception, and info gathering all have its limits. Even if you consider Bourbon's skills are as good as people claim they are (it seems he's finally showing his expertise - he might suck as a secret agent, but noticing Conan is behind Sleeping Kogoro is pretty damn good detective work, it took him almost as long as it took Heiji to notice it, and Heiji is considered a genius).

But no matter how good Bourbon is, he simply can't deduce what's impossible to deduce; and I say it's impossible to deduce it because he doesn't have all the information he needs - and it's highly unlikely he'll get it.

To get to the "Kid was Sherry" conclusion, he'd have to fulfill this list:

a) Know Kid was on the train
b) Suspect Kid and Sherry were partners
c) Suspect Sherry had planned to deceive them by using Kid

Getting a) is pretty simple. It was known that the train would be used by Jirokichi to lure Kid, so it's pretty obvious he'd be there to size up the place.

But then comes the hard part. b).

Kid is known to be a lone wolf - he only employs 1 assistant for his stunts (Akako doesn't count), and both he and his assistant have been around for longer than Sherry's been on the run. One point against the idea of Kid and Sherry being partners.

Next: Kid's and Sherry's paths have never intersected (in the eyes of the BO). Sherry was thought to be hiding in the mountains of Gunma, and Kid has never been spotted there. So contact between them is unlikely. Therefore, a different approach should be taken - The least amount of degrees of separation between Sherry and Kid, according to the data the BO has access to, are three:

Sherry (1) Mouri Kogoro (2) Edogawa Conan / Nakamori Ginzo / Suzuki Jirokichi (3) Kaito Kid

If Amuro humored the theory that Kogoro was sheltering Sherry, then Kogoro becomes part of the plan. Neither Ginzo nor Jirokichi were in the train, and neither of them would collaborate in a criminal stunt, therefore the only link left would be Conan. If we also consider that Amuro now has a suspicion that Conan is pulling the strings of Kogoro, then we simply reduce the amount of degrees of separation by 1, leaving it as:

Sherry (1) Edogawa Conan (2) Kaito Kid

HOWEVER... Would Kid readily help Conan? They're known to be nemeses according to the media, and Kid has nothing to gain from helping him. Not to mention that there's no way in hell for Conan to pull a stunt like this with limited time, little to no resources, no help whatsoever (even if he considers Kogoro as Conan's aide) and no way to contact Kid beforehand.

And then comes the hardest part of all: c).

Either Sherry or Kogoro/Conan had to know about the existence of Bourbon. Which is pretty damn impossible...

...that is, unless Kir was a double agent (via Akai Shuuichi) and had informed them. It would be piss easy for Amuro to gather the information on the stunt at the hospital, and with it, the evidence the FBI employed to ascertain the death of Akai Shuuichi. Evidence that also puts Conan right on the scene. If Amuro gathered all the pieces, then he could deduce that Conan and Akai were acquaintances, hell, even partners (the fact that Akai saved Kogoro and Conan from being sniped by Gin would strengthen this supposition).

But as far as he knows, Akai Shuuichi is dead. Everyone in the FBI thinks he's dead, hell, even his sister thinks he's dead. This means Akai hasn't contacted them at all. Not to mention that there's also the fact that there's "evidence" pointing at Akai being dead (yes, Conan's cellphone). Yes, someone who looked like Akai threw a hand grenade at Bourbon on the train, sure. But can he be certain that he was looking at Akai? Not really. He became suspicious and reviewed his investigation, but that's all he has - a suspicion and his investigation (that points at Akai being dead).

So, yeah. For Amuro to think Kid disguised as Sherry would mean he'd have to humor the idea that Sherry confided in a 7-year-old kid to follow a plan that involved a wanted criminal who may or may not be willing to help them, based on information they may or may not have had, that they were provided by a man who may or may not be dead. And that's even if he gets all the information he needs, and who's gonna give him that information?

So no. I doubt Bourbon will ever find out they were played. And, IMO, I doubt he'd even care about that. He was sent to find Sherry, sure enough, but his true goal is Akai. If I were Amuro, and if I ever got wind of information involving Sherry, at this point, I'd say "who the hell cares?".
Last edited by El Huesudo II on August 4th, 2012, 12:46 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Partsu
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Re: Discussion Thread: Detective Conan Files 828+

Post by Partsu »

El Huesudo II wrote:
Conan 48:69 wrote:Due to Bourbon's proficient in investigation, perception and gathering of information, can't he find out Sherry in Bell Tree Express is actually Kid in disguise?
Nope.
Spoiler: Collapsed for lenght
Investigation, perception, and info gathering all have its limits. Even if you consider Bourbon's skills are as good as people claim they are (it seems he's finally showing his expertise - he might suck as a secret agent, but noticing Conan is behind Sleeping Kogoro is pretty damn good detective work, it took him almost as long as it took Heiji to notice it, and Heiji is considered a genius).

But no matter how good Bourbon is, he simply can't deduce what's impossible to deduce; and I say it's impossible to deduce it because he doesn't have all the information he needs - and it's highly unlikely he'll get it.

To get to the "Kid was Sherry" conclusion, he'd have to fulfill this list:

a) Know Kid was on the train
b) Suspect Kid and Sherry were partners
c) Suspect Sherry had planned to deceive them by using Kid

Getting a) is pretty simple. It was known that the train would be used by Jirokichi to lure Kid, so it's pretty obvious he'd be there to size up the place.

But then comes the hard part. b).

Kid is known to be a lone wolf - he only employs 1 assistant for his stunts (Akako doesn't count), and both he and his assistant have been around for longer than Sherry's been on the run. One point against the idea of Kid and Sherry being partners.

Next: Kid's and Sherry's paths have never intersected (in the eyes of the BO). Sherry was thought to be hiding in the mountains of Gunma, and Kid has never been spotted there. So contact between them is unlikely. Therefore, a different approach should be taken - The least amount of degrees of separation between Sherry and Kid, according to the data the BO has access to, are three:

Sherry (1) Mouri Kogoro (2) Edogawa Conan / Nakamori Ginzo / Suzuki Jirokichi (3) Kaito Kid

If Amuro humored the theory that Kogoro was sheltering Sherry, then Kogoro becomes part of the plan. Neither Ginzo nor Jirokichi were in the train, and neither of them would collaborate in a criminal stunt, therefore the only link left would be Conan. If we also consider that Amuro now has a suspicion that Conan is pulling the strings of Kogoro, then we simply reduce the amount of degrees of separation by 1, leaving it as:

Sherry (1) Edogawa Conan (2) Kaito Kid

HOWEVER... Would Kid readily help Conan? They're known to be nemeses according to the media, and Kid has nothing to gain from helping him. Not to mention that there's no way in hell for Conan to pull a stunt like this with limited time, little to no resources, no help whatsoever (even if he considers Kogoro as Conan's aide) and no way to contact Kid beforehand.

And then comes the hardest part of all: c).

Either Sherry or Kogoro/Conan had to know about the existence of Bourbon. Which is pretty damn impossible...

...that is, unless Kir was a double agent (via Akai Shuuichi) and had informed them. It would be piss easy for Amuro to gather the information on the stunt at the hospital, and with it, the evidence the FBI employed to ascertain the death of Akai Shuuichi. Evidence that also puts Conan right on the scene. If Amuro gathered all the pieces, then he could deduce that Conan and Akai were acquaintances, hell, even partners (the fact that Akai saved Kogoro and Conan from being sniped by Gin would strengthen this supposition).

But as far as he knows, Akai Shuuichi is dead. Everyone in the FBI thinks he's dead, hell, even his sister thinks he's dead. This means Akai hasn't contacted them at all. Not to mention that there's also the fact that there's "evidence" pointing at Akai being dead (yes, Conan's cellphone). Yes, someone who looked like Akai threw a hand grenade at Bourbon on the train, sure. But can he be certain that he was looking at Akai? Not really. He became suspicious and reviewed his investigation, but that's all he has - a suspicion and his investigation (that points at Akai being dead).

So, yeah. For Amuro to think Kid disguised as Sherry would mean he'd have to humor the idea that Sherry confided in a 7-year-old kid to follow a plan that involved a wanted criminal who may or may not be willing to help them, based on information they may or may not have had, that they were provided by a man who may or may not be dead. And that's even if he gets all the information he needs, and who's gonna give him that information?

So no. I doubt Bourbon will ever find out they were played. And, IMO, I doubt he'd even care about that. He was sent to find Sherry, sure enough, but his true goal is Akai. If I were Amuro, and if I ever got wind of information involving Sherry, at this point, I'd say "who the hell cares?".
Bravo!
Ten points and parrot mark!
Are you sure you're not Chek?
or somehow related to her?
Spoiler: things
Haibara for the win!
Certified
AokoxKaito/Kid,
Shinichi/ConanxRan,
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ShinConxRanxShiAi-for laughs
"There is only one truth"
and no one wants Ran to know it
...
bastards!
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El Huesudo II
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Re: Discussion Thread: Detective Conan Files 828+

Post by El Huesudo II »

Partsu wrote:
El Huesudo II wrote:
Conan 48:69 wrote:Due to Bourbon's proficient in investigation, perception and gathering of information, can't he find out Sherry in Bell Tree Express is actually Kid in disguise?
Nope.
Spoiler: Collapsed for lenght
Investigation, perception, and info gathering all have its limits. Even if you consider Bourbon's skills are as good as people claim they are (it seems he's finally showing his expertise - he might suck as a secret agent, but noticing Conan is behind Sleeping Kogoro is pretty damn good detective work, it took him almost as long as it took Heiji to notice it, and Heiji is considered a genius).

But no matter how good Bourbon is, he simply can't deduce what's impossible to deduce; and I say it's impossible to deduce it because he doesn't have all the information he needs - and it's highly unlikely he'll get it.

To get to the "Kid was Sherry" conclusion, he'd have to fulfill this list:

a) Know Kid was on the train
b) Suspect Kid and Sherry were partners
c) Suspect Sherry had planned to deceive them by using Kid

Getting a) is pretty simple. It was known that the train would be used by Jirokichi to lure Kid, so it's pretty obvious he'd be there to size up the place.

But then comes the hard part. b).

Kid is known to be a lone wolf - he only employs 1 assistant for his stunts (Akako doesn't count), and both he and his assistant have been around for longer than Sherry's been on the run. One point against the idea of Kid and Sherry being partners.

Next: Kid's and Sherry's paths have never intersected (in the eyes of the BO). Sherry was thought to be hiding in the mountains of Gunma, and Kid has never been spotted there. So contact between them is unlikely. Therefore, a different approach should be taken - The least amount of degrees of separation between Sherry and Kid, according to the data the BO has access to, are three:

Sherry (1) Mouri Kogoro (2) Edogawa Conan / Nakamori Ginzo / Suzuki Jirokichi (3) Kaito Kid

If Amuro humored the theory that Kogoro was sheltering Sherry, then Kogoro becomes part of the plan. Neither Ginzo nor Jirokichi were in the train, and neither of them would collaborate in a criminal stunt, therefore the only link left would be Conan. If we also consider that Amuro now has a suspicion that Conan is pulling the strings of Kogoro, then we simply reduce the amount of degrees of separation by 1, leaving it as:

Sherry (1) Edogawa Conan (2) Kaito Kid

HOWEVER... Would Kid readily help Conan? They're known to be nemeses according to the media, and Kid has nothing to gain from helping him. Not to mention that there's no way in hell for Conan to pull a stunt like this with limited time, little to no resources, no help whatsoever (even if he considers Kogoro as Conan's aide) and no way to contact Kid beforehand.

And then comes the hardest part of all: c).

Either Sherry or Kogoro/Conan had to know about the existence of Bourbon. Which is pretty damn impossible...

...that is, unless Kir was a double agent (via Akai Shuuichi) and had informed them. It would be piss easy for Amuro to gather the information on the stunt at the hospital, and with it, the evidence the FBI employed to ascertain the death of Akai Shuuichi. Evidence that also puts Conan right on the scene. If Amuro gathered all the pieces, then he could deduce that Conan and Akai were acquaintances, hell, even partners (the fact that Akai saved Kogoro and Conan from being sniped by Gin would strengthen this supposition).

But as far as he knows, Akai Shuuichi is dead. Everyone in the FBI thinks he's dead, hell, even his sister thinks he's dead. This means Akai hasn't contacted them at all. Not to mention that there's also the fact that there's "evidence" pointing at Akai being dead (yes, Conan's cellphone). Yes, someone who looked like Akai threw a hand grenade at Bourbon on the train, sure. But can he be certain that he was looking at Akai? Not really. He became suspicious and reviewed his investigation, but that's all he has - a suspicion and his investigation (that points at Akai being dead).

So, yeah. For Amuro to think Kid disguised as Sherry would mean he'd have to humor the idea that Sherry confided in a 7-year-old kid to follow a plan that involved a wanted criminal who may or may not be willing to help them, based on information they may or may not have had, that they were provided by a man who may or may not be dead. And that's even if he gets all the information he needs, and who's gonna give him that information?

So no. I doubt Bourbon will ever find out they were played. And, IMO, I doubt he'd even care about that. He was sent to find Sherry, sure enough, but his true goal is Akai. If I were Amuro, and if I ever got wind of information involving Sherry, at this point, I'd say "who the hell cares?".
Bravo!
Ten points and parrot mark!
Are you sure you're not Chek?
or somehow related to her?
Not that I know of.

And nah, I bet Chek would be able to take this deduction, flesh it out, maybe even turn it around 180° and give reasons why.
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yamiangie

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Re: Discussion Thread: Detective Conan Files 828+

Post by yamiangie »

Spoiler:
I have to point out that Sera just assaulted a police officer. If she knees a cop in he groin for doing is job I'm worried she's going to end up shooting Kid or something.  She has less restraint than Conan and Conan always seems to lose what little restraint he has when after Kid.
MistyReeyus

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Re: Discussion Thread: Detective Conan Files 828+

Post by MistyReeyus »

Spoiler:
I'm pretty ticked off that the jewel was in a fishless aquarium. Cuz I wanted to see Kaitou Kid freak out.

Sera's certainly got guts to do that to a police inspector. To be honest, my respect for her actually increased a lot when she did that. I know it really shouldn't have, but it did. (Actually, a stupid little part of my brain wants it to turn out that Nakamori was Kaitou Kid in disguise at that time, because for some bizarre reason I really insanely love the thought of Sera kneeing Kaitou Kid in the balls. Not expecting it to happen, though.)

Hoping that Kid's gonna try to collect the "debt" he seems to think Conan owes him from the train case. Or at least interrogate him about said train case. Cuz seriously, I don't think Kid would let that slide too easily.
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