Shinichi+Ran

[Hime-Chan]

I understand the fact Divinely Ethereal is angry about Ran, I've seen her popping up kids and staying at home only in fanfictions, and a lot. I get angry sometimes that she's being stupid and doesn't try to move on with life, but maybe she's just lacking a bit of confidence? She also didn't grew up in a really stable family situation, and that probably doesn't help her either.
I don't know if you're up do date with the recent files, but the last one raised quite a bit of angriness on that subject, from a lot of people.
As for Shinichi: being compared to someone doesn't mean being the exact same person, when you speak to someone about sherlock, what are they going to tell you?
-That he's extremely intelligent
-That he solves crimes
-That he's cool.

RMed: agree with you, the post above^^
TWICE: don't have an answer

[kirite]

Wut

I never understood the whole DIE FOR MY SHIP HOW DARE he/she BE WITH SOMEONE ELSE GRRRRR thing.  People can ship whoever they want.  Personally I think projecting yourself on to an anime character sounds quite unhealthy for the mind.  Sometimes I wonder if people who act like this are really jealous.  People and characters not things you can own, geeze.

As for Ran.  She did want to give up multiple times.  But Conan always ask for her to wait for him/gives her reasons to stick around by showing his feelings.  He clarified his intent on white day and confessed his feelings in England.  I didn't realise the topic of her motivation and whether she knows Shinichi likes her or not is still an issue after those chapters.  

I didn't realise you have to date to have a life.  I'm quite content in being single personally, and considering how much Ran cares about other men I'm guessing she'll be content to stay single as well.  Plus I thought going to beaches, festivals, and restaurants with your millionaire best friend sound pretty good.  

Happy belated single awareness day <3

[Divinely Ethereal]

And what makes you think Ran WANTS to date Araide or Eisuke?

You're missing the point. Again. What matters here is AUTONOMY/CHOICE.  Regardless of who Ran actually wants to date, she needs to have the POWER TO MAKE THAT CHOICE. Kudo doesn't even want to give her the choice, judging by his attitude to Araide/Eisuke. He's possessive, not loving.

+ everything IHKF said to you

I said you sounded pathetic because you called pathetic the fact that Ran chose to be forever faithful to Shinichi.

I stand by what I said that waiting 10 years for a guy who is never coming back and thus wasting your youth away is indeed pathetic, and IHKF supported me. It appears you're all alone in your righteous neck of the woods, buddy. Let's just hope nothing like what happened to Ran in OVA 9 happens to you IRL so you don't pull a Miss Havisham....

[Dwalin]

Anyway, I think it would be better if Gosho wouldn’t listen to anyone of the fans who want changes in the story, both people who think like me and those who want the opposite. I think that in most of the cases things could only worsen if the fans could really take over because most of them are too aggressive and extreme. I have already become addicted to Conan forums like drugs but in the last months I always get depressed about how many users are always at each other's (and also Gosho's) throats.

I stand by what I said that waiting 10 years for a guy who is never coming back and thus wasting your youth away is indeed pathetic, and IHKF supported me. It appears you're all alone in your righteous neck of the woods, buddy

You and IHKF (and even this whole forum) aren't the whole world. Believe me, i have met PLENTY of people who think like me regarding this particular aspect of life.

[IHKF]

Wut

I never understood the whole DIE FOR MY SHIP HOW DARE he/she BE WITH SOMEONE ELSE GRRRRR thing.  People can ship whoever they want.  Personally I think projecting yourself on to an anime character sounds quite unhealthy for the mind.  Sometimes I wonder if people who act like this are really jealous.  People and characters not things you can own, geeze.

As for Ran.  She did want to give up multiple times.  But Conan always ask for her to wait for him/gives her reasons to stick around by showing his feelings.  He clarified his intent on white day and confessed his feelings in England.  I didn't realise the topic of her motivation and whether she knows Shinichi likes her or not is still an issue after those chapters. 

I didn't realise you have to date to have a life.  I'm quite content in being single personally, and considering how much Ran cares about other men I'm guessing she'll be content to stay single as well.  Plus I thought going to beaches, festivals, and restaurants with your millionaire best friend sound pretty good. 

Happy belated single awareness day <3

Ehh it's a part of life. Sadly. And I know, that's why it annoys me when people get compassionate over an argument for that reason. (I get compassionate over ALL of my arguments, not just because it's what I ship.) it is VERY unhealthy. And the people who are like that annoy me a lot of the time. D:

When did she want to give up? I've only ever seen her cry and ask why he isn't there and when he's coming back. I don't think we've ever seen her actually may a valiant attempt to move on to a healthier relationship.

You don't need to date to have a life, but like it or not, finding your significant other is kinda what stands between you and passing on the blood-line, and having many wonderful experiences you wouldn't get anything similar to otherwise. xD

Anyway, I think it would be better if Gosho wouldn’t listen to anyone of the fans who want changes in the story, both people who think like me and those who want the opposite. I think that in most of the cases things could only worsen if the fans could really take over because most of them are too aggressive and extreme. I have already become addicted to Conan forums like drugs but in the last months I always get depressed about how many users are always at each other's (and also Gosho's) throats.

I stand by what I said that waiting 10 years for a guy who is never coming back and thus wasting your youth away is indeed pathetic, and IHKF supported me. It appears you're all alone in your righteous neck of the woods, buddy

You and IHKF (and even this whole forum) aren't the whole world. Believe me, i have met PLENTY of people who think like me regarding this particular aspect of life.

Why? He's not very talented at writing anything much but mystery. Heaven knows his main couple is as bad as EdwardxBella. (Yes. i just compared ShinRan to a Twilight couple. DEAL WITH IT. )

Every author needs a little constructive criticism. xD lol

Yes, but the portion who think like you probably is a whole lot smaller than that that think like us.

There is NO SENSE in waiting for a guy that you don't know has real feelings for you, you hardly have any contact with, and is ALSO a womanizer. (Oh come on. Look at the first episode. Shinichi is a perv. )

It's just putting yourself down and not letting yourself fly to your full potential. Personally, I think Ran, Ai, AND Ayumi are all WAY TOO GOOD for Shinichi.

Ran would be so much freaking happier if she found a guy that would argue with her but still be... you know... AFFECTIONATE and NON-POSSESSIVE? XD

[Divinely Ethereal]

It's just an anime, calm down

Well, unlike some, I don't watch much anime, and I'm very selective about the ones I do. Nor do I spend much time hanging around/running/moderating anime websites/forums, or have over 3000 posts under my belt -.-

So pardon me  :-*

[Dwalin]

Yes, but the portion who think like you probably is a whole lot smaller than that that think like us.

Maybe, but the minority has also rights to exist. The majority of love stories in this world aren't like ShinRan at all, so why don't you just stay happy with being the majority without dreaming of destroying the stories which are the minority? To be honest, I like ShinRan not because I feel "connected" with them, like you previously said, but because I like stories where the first love is also the last one and where the couple involved are childhood friends. If it's almost impossible in real life, it's good it's possible in fiction at least. It wouldn't be really nice of you to destroy one of the last rare examples of "first love which lasts till death" stories just to keep yourself happy for a couple of days, if you had the possibility. You already have the majority of the love stories, remember? The concept of "eternal faithfulness" which you seem to hate so much almost doesn't exist even in fiction. Why don't leave to the minority at least something to keep them happy?

[Aokochan]

I didn't realise you have to date to have a life.  I'm quite content in being single personally, and considering how much Ran cares about other men I'm guessing she'll be content to stay single as well.  Plus I thought going to beaches, festivals, and restaurants with your millionaire best friend sound pretty good.  

Happy belated single awareness day <3

+1000  :-* I think Ran can be happy without dating anyone!
Oh, and happy belated single awareness day to you too

[Divinely Ethereal]

Heaven knows his main couple is as bad as EdwardxBella. (Yes. i just compared ShinRan to a Twilight couple. DEAL WITH IT. )

Not an unreasonable comparison, imo.  Both females have very little sense of self-worth outside of their interest. Mind, I don't think Ran would try to kill herself like Bella if Shinichi left her, but wasting away seems just as bad -.-

I don't care for this whole Die-for-my-Ship junk either, but I do take offence to ships that I regard as anti-feminist or unhealthy. For the most part, though, a pairing is only as good as a writer can make it. If a fanfic writer can convince me that ShinRan is far from the abject failure Gosho made it in canon, then by all means...I've been converted to some less than, ahem, orthodox  pairings thanks to excellent fanfic

[IHKF]

Yes, but the portion who think like you probably is a whole lot smaller than that that think like us.

Maybe, but the minority has also rights to exist. The majority of love stories in this world aren't like ShinRan at all, so why don't you just stay happy with being the majority without dreaming of destroying the stories which are the minority? To be honest, I like ShinRan not because I feel "connected" with them, like you previously said, but because I like stories where the first love is also the last one and where the couple involved are childhood friends. If it's almost impossible in real life, it's good it's possible in fiction at least. It wouldn't be really nice of you to destroy one of the last rare examples of "first love which lasts till death" stories just to keep yourself happy for a couple of days, if you had the possibility. You already have the majority of the love stories, remember? The concept of "eternal faithfulness" which you seem to hate so much almost doesn't exist even in fiction. Why don't leave to the minority at least something to keep them happy?

Yes, it does have a right to exist. (I support AyuCon, duh. )

No, most aren't like ShinRan. Because love stories usually have healthy relationships. I don't dream of killing the minority's dreams. I'm actually usually one to stand up for the Underdog. But this couple? This relationship? No way in heck. EVER.

I didn't say EVERYBODY felt connected with them, but a large portion of ShinRan fans happen to feel that Ran is the best thing since sliced bread (their vanity). Or they want to be her.

It's not impossible in real life at all, just really really really unlikely to happen. Which is another reason why I doubt ShinRan so much.

First love lasts till death? HAH! XD Don't make me bust my lungs open now! I doubt this is "LOVE" in the FIRST PLACE! XD SERIOUSLY! They're TEENAGERS! WHO HAVE HORMONES! And he has shown nothing but POSSESSIVENESS of her! XD Love my butt.

Happy for a couple of days? Really? Is that SERIOUSLY why you think I'm arguing? No. I'm arguing because this relationship is unhealthy and it isn't actual love and it's about on the same level as Twilight when it comes to their definition of "love".

Eternal faithfulness to somebody you KNOW loves you back is WAY DIFFERENT than faithfulness to a boy you don't even know returns your feelings. Don't confuse the two.

Because the minority doesn't have a healthy definition this time around.

[Dwalin]

Because the minority doesn't have a healthy definition this time around.

"Unhealthy, pathetic, idiot". Are these really the best arguments you and Divinely Ethereal can bring forward? I (and many other people who unfortunately never come to this forum) just don't see things in the same way you do. You just interpret the events and characters in the way you want. It's just a point of view, at it's not like everybody who doesn't agree is a blasphemer or "unhealthy". I honestly don't think Shinichi is being egoistically possessive, I think he just doesn't want to lose Ran and I don't think Ran's faithfulness is pathetic (everybody would like to have a faithful wife, I have never seen a man who would like to marry a woman who cheats on him). I won't argue anymore, but I think that if we are "unhealthy", you too are "unhealthily" convinced that you are always right and everybody who doesn't agree with you is to be looked on as something unnatural. You should really learn to respect others' opinions. Not everybody who doesn't stand up to you ideals is good-for-nothing.

[sonoci]

@kirite: You are amazing. Utterly amazing <3 I agree with everything you've said

@IHKF: Regarding the "people arguing being nature" bit. Aokochan is quite right, we all can try to be more polite here, it's not impossible and in fact recommended. There is a difference between arguing in a legitimate way and a rude way. For quite a few sections, there were rude remarks scattered about. This is not acceptable not only to a mature community but ESPECIALLY for a forum. I know there's the whole "oh lawl the internet is never serious" so many think it wouldn't be so important. For the most part it isn't. But when there starts a debate where people actually want to speculate and discuss seriously, the best discussion stems from polite and organized comments.

This is the Shin+Ran thread. Insults between any users at all do not apply to the topic. Thus they are not only rude, but technically off topic.

There is also the added factor that no one here is saying anything. In other words, we have to type everything we're posting, assumedly reading it as well to watch for spelling/grammar/structure. For this reason, when immature insults are thrown about it is considered even more immature because you have time to think about every little thing you're writing. Everything you're saying can be proofread. Every thought you come up with can be revised. It is the obligation of any poster to make sure they're being as clear as they can be. Unlike in real life where someone is speaking to you directly and there's pressure to respond immediately, here you have as much time as humanely possible to word your thoughts. That's why it is highly looked down upon to have flaming or insults to real people: basically the overall view is "Really? You read that over and actually thought that wouldn't be rude at all?"

Also, explaining why people get all up in arms does not make it right. Right now we are discussing fictional characters with no direct basis in reality. Why should anyone, such as Dwalin and Divinely Ethereal, get mad at real people? It would be like a child complaining about his hate for vegetables when his parents are giving him fruit. It doesn't relate, it doesn't make sense.

And...opinions are useless things to argue over. Everyone in the world will never all at once agree with something, so why fight over them? If the opinions cause something harmful to happen, it's a different case, but the opinions themselves do nothing.

Ex:
"I like the color green."
"I like red better."
"...Well, agree to disagree."
compared to
"I like the color green."
"I think red is bet-AGH I'M BLEEDING. WHY DID YOU DO THAT?"
"HAH, DON'T THINK IT'S BETTER NOW, HUH?"

.........to.......finish off.

Yes, but the portion who think like you probably is a whole lot smaller than that that think like us.

And here is a perfect example of how the internet allows you to rethink and revise your thoughts.

In real life if I had heard this, and in fact I kind of did while trying to type a reply, I would have just stared blankly at you with my mouth gaping open and my eyes wide, speechless.

Interesting tidbit: I have probably been editing and rewriting this portion for at least a half-hour. And if anyone thinks "Geez, you need to spend your time more wisely" I was doing so for the sake of IHKF.

IHKF is a real person and in no way do I want to hurt her in any way. Even if I don't know her personally, I don't want any of my words to make her feel uncomfortable.

I probably had three versions of a reply to this quote, but I'm sticking to this one.

All I will say directly to this quote is that it shook me enough that I was disturbed, anxious and fidgety for at least 30 minutes. Thus is the effect that comments can have on people.

Please everyone, for morality's sake, let's be civilized. 

Because the minority doesn't have a healthy definition this time around.

"Unhealthy, pathetic, idiot". I (and many other people who unfortunately never come to this forum) just don't see things in the same way you do. You just interpret the events and characters in the way you want. It's just a point of view, at it's not like everybody who doesn't agree is a blasphemer or "unhealthy". I honestly don't think Shinichi is being egoistically possessive, I think he just doesn't want to lose Ran and I don't think Ran's faithfulness is pathetic (everybody would like to have a faithful wife, I have never seen a man who would like to marry a woman who cheats on him).

Well said Dwalin, if you could see me I'd be clapping for ya 

[Kor]

Seems like I'll have to read the last two pages to see what happened here. Might send some PMs as well.

[sonoci]

Might send some PMs as well.

If one comes to me, expect a quick apologetic reply :'D

OTL I always stem off topic T-T

[IHKF]

Because the minority doesn't have a healthy definition this time around.

"Unhealthy, pathetic, idiot". Are these really the best arguments you and Divinely Ethereal can bring forward? I (and many other people who unfortunately never come to this forum) just don't see things in the same way you do. You just interpret the events and characters in the way you want. It's just a point of view, at it's not like everybody who doesn't agree is a blasphemer or "unhealthy". I honestly don't think Shinichi is being egoistically possessive, I think he just doesn't want to lose Ran and I don't think Ran's faithfulness is pathetic (everybody would like to have a faithful wife, I have never seen a man who would like to marry a woman who cheats on him). I won't argue anymore, but I think that if we are "unhealthy", you too are "unhealthily" convinced that you are always right and everybody who doesn't agree with you is to be looked on as something unnatural. You should really learn to respect others' opinions. Not everybody who doesn't stand up to you ideals is good-for-nothing.

Oh yes, because I was the one who said all of that. lol

I just think it's kind of sad that everybody can look at Edward and Bella's relationship and think it's unhealthy and not see that the same thing is going on here, just to a lesser extent. (And no, I'm not defending Twilight. I hate it as much as anybody else here. xD

Cheat on him, eh? I had no idea they considered one another to be officially going out. Especially since Ran hasn't stated that she like him back to his face. O_o No, I know I'm not always right. And I've said a couple of times that I was wrong. Maybe you should look more into that before making that statement.

@IHKF: Regarding the "people arguing being nature" bit. Aokochan is quite right, we all can try to be more polite here, it's not impossible and in fact recommended. There is a difference between arguing in a legitimate way and a rude way. For quite a few sections, there were rude remarks scattered about. This is not acceptable not only to a mature community but ESPECIALLY for a forum. I know there's the whole "oh lawl the internet is never serious" so many think it wouldn't be so important. For the most part it isn't. But when there starts a debate where people actually want to speculate and discuss seriously, the best discussion stems from polite and organized comments.

This is the Shin+Ran thread. Insults between any users at all do not apply to the topic. Thus they are not only rude, but technically off topic.

There is also the added factor that no one here is saying anything. In other words, we have to type everything we're posting, assumedly reading it as well to watch for spelling/grammar/structure. For this reason, when immature insults are thrown about it is considered even more immature because you have time to think about every little thing you're writing. Everything you're saying can be proofread. Every thought you come up with can be revised. It is the obligation of any poster to make sure they're being as clear as they can be. Unlike in real life where someone is speaking to you directly and there's pressure to respond immediately, here you have as much time as humanely possible to word your thoughts. That's why it is highly looked down upon to have flaming or insults to real people: basically the overall view is "Really? You read that over and actually thought that wouldn't be rude at all?"

Also, explaining why people get all up in arms does not make it right. Right now we are discussing fictional characters with no direct basis in reality. Why should anyone, such as Dwalin and Divinely Ethereal, get mad at real people? It would be like a child complaining about his hate for vegetables when his parents are giving him fruit. It doesn't relate, it doesn't make sense.

And...opinions are useless things to argue over. Everyone in the world will never all at once agree with something, so why fight over them? If the opinions cause something harmful to happen, it's a different case, but the opinions themselves do nothing.

Ex:
"I like the color green."
"I like red better."
"...Well, agree to disagree."
compared to
"I like the color green."
"I think red is bet-AGH I'M BLEEDING. WHY DID YOU DO THAT?"
"HAH, DON'T THINK IT'S BETTER NOW, HUH?"

.........to.......finish off.

Yes, but the portion who think like you probably is a whole lot smaller than that that think like us.

And here is a perfect example of how the internet allows you to rethink and revise your thoughts.

In real life if I had heard this, and in fact I kind of did while trying to type a reply, I would have just stared blankly at you with my mouth gaping open and my eyes wide, speechless.

Interesting tidbit: I have probably been editing and rewriting this portion for at least a half-hour. And if anyone thinks "Geez, you need to spend your time more wisely" I was doing so for the sake of IHKF.

IHKF is a real person and in no way do I want to hurt her in any way. Even if I don't know her personally, I don't want any of my words to make her feel uncomfortable.

I probably had three versions of a reply to this quote, but I'm sticking to this one.

All I will say directly to this quote is that it shook me enough that I was disturbed, anxious and fidgety for at least 30 minutes. Thus is the effect that comments can have on people.

Please everyone, for morality's sake, let's be civilized.  ;)

People will argue and throw names. It happens. That IS in human nature. ESPECIALLY when arguing about something one is passionate about. It happens.

Once again, that is also of human nature. People will fight. People will argue. People will call each other names. People will feel insulted even though they shouldn't. It's the way the world goes 'round. Yin and Yang. xD You can't enjoy the good things if there aren't any bad things.

What else is there to argue about? Opinions are WHY we argue. You never argue unless it is to change somebody's OPINION. That is the main point of ARGUING. xD There is no other reason.

And BTW, I said such a thing earlier because most people think they are 'special' and would agree because they feel THEY wouldn't do it even though they would. I think it's perfectly logical to assume most people would agree with us for their own vanity's sake if not because they really take notice and think the way we do. xD