Question on Vermouth and APTX4869

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Stopwatch

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Re: Question on Vermouth and APTX4869

Post by Stopwatch »

Yeah, it seems most likely that Sharon is the real one...
...though some people have said that Sharon's own mother or grandmother or so on may have been the original one. I can't remember where exactly I saw the theory but it basically goes like this:

-On Sharon's debut her parents coincidentally happened to die in a fire.

In those days it was a lot easier to create another identity and not be caught, also the time of death ect; wouldn't be as accurate. It's possible Vermouth set a timer on the house and placed two corpses which were roughly similar in build inside. This way not only is 'Sharon's mum' conviently out of the way but Sharon is placed in good position for her career (people would be more interested in a person with a 'tragic past') and, if she was in the BO at this point that would be even more important considering that the Org likes to have people who are famous or high up. My last point on this is that the entire few paragraphs on her parents dying seem unnecessary. Sure, it helps set up the 'no angel has ever shined on me' but something that happened so long ago wouldn't affect her this much 20 years later so this being foreshadowing is very likely.

-Whatever caused Vermouth to stop aging/de-age happened before the creation of APTX 4869

There's lots of evidence for this e.g. Gin mentioning that Shinichi was the first person he'd used it on and plenty more things I'm not going to look up now. Why is this mentioned then? The apotoxin and the BO are crucial to the plot so Aoyama wouldn't put something like this in, lampshade it and then not follow through. Haibara's parents were working on something that later became the apotoxin, immortality/de-aging is strongly involved from the looks of things. Her parents went to work at the Org's labs when Akemi was young. If we say Akemi was in her 20's (I'd say about 25 but I can't be certain) when she died then the research has been going on for at least 15-20 years.

....I've totally forgotten where I was going with this, erm, I'll try and find the theory again and link to it instead of going from memory and adding things that sound right... sorry 'bout that

Abs. used ix-nay on your red text. It was super effective - Abs.
Last edited by Abs. on April 25th, 2011, 11:53 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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bash7353 wrote:I kind of always assumed that Haneda's parents might've had names.
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Shuusgirl
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Re: Question on Vermouth and APTX4869

Post by Shuusgirl »

Stopwatch wrote: Yeah, it seems most likely that Sharon is the real one...
...though some people have said that Sharon's own mother or grandmother or so on may have been the original one. I can't remember where exactly I saw the theory but it basically goes like this:

-On Sharon's debut her parents coincidentally happened to die in a fire.

In those days it was a lot easier to create another identity and not be caught, also the time of death ect; wouldn't be as accurate. It's possible Vermouth set a timer on the house and placed two corpses which were roughly similar in build inside. This way not only is 'Sharon's mum' conviently out of the way but Sharon is placed in good position for her career (people would be more interested in a person with a 'tragic past') and, if she was in the BO at this point that would be even more important considering that the Org likes to have people who are famous or high up. My last point on this is that the entire few paragraphs on her parents dying seem unnecessary. Sure, it helps set up the 'no angel has ever shined on me' but something that happened so long ago wouldn't affect her this much 20 years later so this being foreshadowing is very likely.

-Whatever caused Vermouth to stop aging/de-age happened before the creation of APTX 4869

There's lots of evidence for this e.g. Gin mentioning that Shinichi was the first person he'd used it on and plenty more things I'm not going to look up now. Why is this mentioned then? The apotoxin and the BO are crucial to the plot so Aoyama wouldn't put something like this in, lampshade it and then not follow through. Haibara's parents were working on something that later became the apotoxin, immortality/de-aging is strongly involved from the looks of things. Her parents went to work at the Org's labs when Akemi was young. If we say Akemi was in her 20's (I'd say about 25 but I can't be certain) when she died then the research has been going on for at least 15-20 years.

....I've totally forgotten where I was going with this, erm, I'll try and find the theory again and link to it instead of going from memory and adding things that sound right... sorry 'bout that

Abs. used ix-nay on your red text. It was super effective - Abs.
Yeah, that fire deal caught my eye too.  It just bugs me when the word "coincidence" is used in a mystery.
And in the second point, I'm assuming you were saying that since she stopped aging before the APTX, then she either took an early incarnation of the drug, which caused her to stop aging, or was the catalyst for the research, and either way would put her at not aging for the last 50+ years, meaning that she could really be Sharon's mom just from birth date.  Is that right?
"I have no data yet. It is a capital mistake to theorize before one has data. Insensibly one begins to twist facts to suit theories, instead of theories to suit facts." --Sherlock Holmes
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Stopwatch

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Re: Question on Vermouth and APTX4869

Post by Stopwatch »

Yeah, that's what I was trying to say but I'm not that good at putting things into words, thank you for summing it up.  :D
And..
Stopwatch wrote: Abs. used ix-nay on your red text. It was super effective - Abs.

@Abs. Thanks for that
Terry Pratchett wrote: The trouble with having an open mind, of course, is that people will insist on coming along and trying to put things in it.
bash7353 wrote:I kind of always assumed that Haneda's parents might've had names.
Spoiler: Box full of stuff
Write a Will
Image
Some year's SS by Abs. :D
Image
DCW SS from Anime Girl 4 Eva]
Image
Thanks, cinna ^^
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Chekhov MacGuffin
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Re: Question on Vermouth and APTX4869

Post by Chekhov MacGuffin »

I'm kicking an old topic here, but I was thinking about how the name "Vineyard" is conveniently Black Org themed. I wonder if Vermouth came up with it as a bit of a personal joke when picking a name for her latest incarnation? The implication here is that Sharon Vineyard is also an alias, so Vermouth had a prior identity.
Last edited by Chekhov MacGuffin on November 27th, 2011, 8:26 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Shuusgirl
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Re: Question on Vermouth and APTX4869

Post by Shuusgirl »

Chekhov MacGuffin wrote: I'm kicking an old topic here, but I was thinking about how the name "Vineyard" is conveniently Black Org themed. I wonder if Vermouth came up with it as a bit of a personal joke when picking a name for her latest incarnation? The implication here is that Sharon Vineyard is also an alias, so Vermouth had a prior identity.
Yeah, I've been wondering if Sharon was Vermouth's first incarnation.  The whole "my parents died in a fire when I first got into the public light" thing seems really suspicious.
"I have no data yet. It is a capital mistake to theorize before one has data. Insensibly one begins to twist facts to suit theories, instead of theories to suit facts." --Sherlock Holmes
Yeah Kogoro, did you read this one?
Feb914

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Re: Question on Vermouth and APTX4869

Post by Feb914 »

Sharon's parents dead seems more to hide her true identity and to make a truly new person (known as 'Sharon Vineyard').
Conan also do the same thing ('his parents' go abroad all the time, which makes Kogoro and Ran never ask for his past again).
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mangaluva
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Re: Question on Vermouth and APTX4869

Post by mangaluva »

I think Vineyard was just Vermouth having fun with names. Could refer to her having a higher rank.
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