Movie 13..... marks the end of conan?

[Kaetlin]

Yukiko was never that great at disguising herself so the chances of that are extremely low.

Huh?  She's just as talented as Kid and Vermouth are at disguises.  When she dressed up pretending to be Conan's Mother way back when, she had everyone tricked.  The only other time we see her use a disguise is during the Halloween Costume party on the boat (ep 345).  Her medusa disguise was enough that nobody recognized her, and her disguises for Conan and Heiji were enough to fool everyone who saw them.

I'm not counting the North Star #3 case, since she didn't really wear much of a disguise.  Changing hair style and putting on a hat and sun glasses does not count as a disguise.

I have to disagree. Yukiko herself has stated she was never as good as Chris/Vermouth when it came to disguising herself. So she is NOT on par with Kid/Vermouth and as further evidence Yukiko has never disguised herself as the opposite sex like the other two. Her disguises come more from her altering her appearance of herself, like she is already working with a set canvas to paint her image while Kid/Vermouth can mimic almost anyone they please of both genders. Also Yukiko's acting is in question, yes she is a good actor to be able to mimic from young to old of the female gender..but can she really do it for the male gender?

As for her disguising herself to the point no one can recognize her, that is true but that wasn't the issue. The issue was if Yukiko had the skill to disguise herself as Gin and mimic his personality which would put her at the level of Vermouth/Kid...and I doubt she can pull of the appearance side, let alone the personality side.

yes but lets not forget, she has less experience than the other two since she quit acting and disguising after a few short years when she became pregnant with Shinichi. Therefore, she didn't have quite a lot of time to work on her disguises. =P

[TheBlind]

yes but lets not forget, she has less experience than the other two since she quit acting and disguising after a few short years when she became pregnant with Shinichi. Therefore, she didn't have quite a lot of time to work on her disguises. =P

She retired from acting after marrying Shinichi's father, Yusaku and time has no issue here. Both Yukiko and Sharon started learning from the original Kid at the same time and Yukiko claimed Sharon was better. Yeah, if Yukiko kept at it, she might of been better than she is now but nowhere near the level of Kid and Vermouth. If this was something you can "practice" your way too, you would have a entire group of B.O. members with the skills of Kid and Vermouth.

I see it like sports, yes practice can make you a star at the High School and College level, but practice doesn't take you to the Professional level unless you already had the raw talent to begin with.

[GinRei]

Of course it's something you can practice.  The only thing that isn't practicable is the range of voices you can make.  Everything else is something you can practice.  The reason the entire BO can't do it is because... well, if you had one thing that made you stand out from every one else in your organization, why would you go and give that ability to everyone?

[TheBlind]

Of course it's something you can practice.  The only thing that isn't practicable is the range of voices you can make.  Everything else is something you can practice.  The reason the entire BO can't do it is because... well, if you had one thing that made you stand out from every one else in your organization, why would you go and give that ability to everyone?

Sorry GinRei but that's a weak argument. So you are saying that the skill level of Kid and Vermouth can be reached simple by practicing but the reason B.O. doesn't implement this skill as a mandatory thing for all it's member is to allow Vermouth to feel like she's special?

If this was something that could be learned and mastered solely by practicing I have no doubt in my mind the head of the B.O. would have Vermouth teaching it even against her will and he would go even further and use resources to capture the new Kid and anyone who came into contact with the old Kid (Yukiko) for this ability.

We are talking about the ability to perfectly mimic another person's appearance, the B.O.'s would have endless possibilities for something like this just to ignore it if it could be mastered by anyone.

[Kaetlin]

Of course it's something you can practice.  The only thing that isn't practicable is the range of voices you can make.  Everything else is something you can practice.  The reason the entire BO can't do it is because... well, if you had one thing that made you stand out from every one else in your organization, why would you go and give that ability to everyone?

Sorry GinRei but that's a weak argument. So you are saying that the skill level of Kid and Vermouth can be reached simple by practicing but the reason B.O. doesn't implement this skill as a mandatory thing for all it's member is to allow Vermouth to feel like she's special?

If this was something that could be learned and mastered solely by practicing I have no doubt in my mind the head of the B.O. would have Vermouth teaching it even against her will and he would go even further and use resources to capture the new Kid and anyone who came into contact with the old Kid (Yukiko) for this ability.

We are talking about the ability to perfectly mimic another person's appearance, the B.O.'s would have endless possibilities for something like this just to ignore it if it could be mastered by anyone.

I thought GinRei had a point. Maybe the way he said it wast very strong, but what he's saying it that like you say earlier, practice does not equal quality, whereas raw talent is more important than experience. Like GinRei said, the B.O. don't bother learning is because there really is no need. Besides, if they aren't as good at Vermouth, then he more of them disguising = more getting caught. THe B.O. operate in the shadows, so all they really need is Vermouth. However, rather than Vermouth not wanting to "teach" her talent, the necesity of the rest of the B.O. learing to disguise is not important.
And I don't even think the B.O. is after Kid are they? Isn't it another group of criminals?
Basically, Yukiko isn't as talented, but if she put more effort and practice in, I'm sure she will be almost as good at Vermouth. Like you said, raw talent is important, but I think Yukiko is pretty dang talented.

[Ran94]

I think that the movie 13 really marks the end of Detective Conan...
For me this isn't a bad idea!!!

[Benitantei]

YOOO!when i saw the trailer,i just "Oh my, oh my i havta replay it again...
and some questions came to my mind:
1. gin holding conan's mouth right??is it only conan's dream??or is it a reality??or it's haibara or someone else disguise as conan??
2. how did gin found out conan's identity??is it from bourbon?vermouth?or KIR/Rena?
3. Gin's hair!!!it's white!!! if u watched in the series or in Countdown to heaven,it's blond!am i right??

i hope this movie is not gonna be the end of conan...i'm still waiting for more mysteries and love stories in this anime...
VERY INTERESTING!

MERRY X-MAS AND HAPPY NEW YEAR...

[GinRei]

Sorry GinRei but that's a weak argument. So you are saying that the skill level of Kid and Vermouth can be reached simple by practicing but the reason B.O. doesn't implement this skill as a mandatory thing for all it's member is to allow Vermouth to feel like she's special?

If this was something that could be learned and mastered solely by practicing I have no doubt in my mind the head of the B.O. would have Vermouth teaching it even against her will and he would go even further and use resources to capture the new Kid and anyone who came into contact with the old Kid (Yukiko) for this ability.

We are talking about the ability to perfectly mimic another person's appearance, the B.O.'s would have endless possibilities for something like this just to ignore it if it could be mastered by anyone.

Perhaps not equal level, but comparable level.  The reason they don't need to though, is because (as stated a couple of posts ago) the BO operates in the shadows.  They don't need disguises, though they may be helpful.  The reason the organization doesn't force practicing is because it would take years to make that work worthwhile.  There's no telling how long it takes to master for those without natural talent, but I'd wager at least a decade or more, since even those with natural talent seem to have taken 5+ years to master it.

[TheBlind]

Perhaps not equal level, but comparable level.  The reason they don't need to though, is because (as stated a couple of posts ago) the BO operates in the shadows.  They don't need disguises, though they may be helpful.  The reason the organization doesn't force practicing is because it would take years to make that work worthwhile.  There's no telling how long it takes to master for those without natural talent, but I'd wager at least a decade or more, since even those with natural talent seem to have taken 5+ years to master it.

It seems were are starting to agree. The way I see it, those without the natural talent can achieve the level of Yukiko with practice, where she can fool the average person but can't really get creative with her disguises outside her canvas(useless to the B.O.). The ones with the natural talent have no set canvas like Kid and Vermouth so they may mimic anyone they please(useful to the B.O.). For Yukiko to gain this level, if it's even possible, would take so much dedication and time that it might take a good chunk of her lifetime making the skill somewhat useless so the B.O. won't invest any time in pursuing this ability.

Seems like you are trying to say the same in that highlighted line which brings us back to the question: Is Yukiko on the same level as Kid or Vermouth and can she get their with more practice?
The answer to that is no and lets say she practices for eternity and reaches it, if you add that same proportion of practice to Vermouth and Kid, they would most likely reach a level that they can now even mimic the habits of their victims(usually what gives them away), making it the perfect disguise.

[TheBlind]

Like GinRei said, the B.O. don't bother learning is because there really is no need. Besides, if they aren't as good at Vermouth, then he more of them disguising = more getting caught.

Actually I would think a organization like the B.O. would need such a skill for obvious reasons. But like you said if they aren't as good a Vermouth than it would be pointless which brings us to the original argument in which Yukiko "could practice" herself to the level of Vermouth and Kid. If this was possible just by practicing the B.O. would of already have a group of members with this ability, not just one which shows it's a natural talent.

And I don't even think the B.O. is after Kid are they? Isn't it another group of criminals?

What I meant was that if this was a skill that could be achieved solely by practice, the B.O would focus part of their attention into capturing Kid to learn the skill and replace key figures in Japan's government with their own agents. They would control Japan overnight and slowly start branching out.

Yukiko isn't as talented, but if she put more effort and practice in, I'm sure she will be almost as good at Vermouth

I disagree..and will avoid like sounding lime a broken record. . I like Yukiko, shes a funny character but..no. Like I said before, she has the ability to do marvels within her range, which already makes her special but this is takes a backseat due to the abilities of Vermouth and Kid.

[GinRei]

Well, Yukiko has to have had some incredibly high level of natural talent for Toichi to have accepted her as an apprentice.  Remember, the only people he seems to have trained at all were Yukiko, Vermouth, and Kaito.  It seems to mostly be a case of her stopping long before the other two did, either in practice or in her lessons.  Either way, she had the potential to reach the same level as them, but just isn't there.

[marioguy]

Why are you arguing if Gin is really Yukiko? That doesn't even make any sense. I do remember her dressing up as Gin in the intro of movie 6, but that's not canon.

I showed my friend the trailer. He's also a big fan of DC. He said, "Yes, that kid finally dies!" That was hilarious.

[elijah_014]

wHoa... the trailer was really good.. HopE thiS moviE doesn'T end DC because i'm a Fan over 10 yeaRs right nOw..

[Kaetlin]

Why are you arguing if Gin is really Yukiko? That doesn't even make any sense. I do remember her dressing up as Gin in the intro of movie 6, but that's not canon.

I showed my friend the trailer. He's also a big fan of DC. He said, "Yes, that kid finally dies!" That was hilarious.

hehe you got it all wrong. we are arguing whether Yukiko's disguising ability is matched to Vermouth and Kid's and the answer is no but with practice, she will get better, although probably not as good as the other 2 ever.

[TheBlind]

Well, Yukiko has to have had some incredibly high level of natural talent for Toichi to have accepted her as an apprentice.  Remember, the only people he seems to have trained at all were Yukiko, Vermouth, and Kaito.  It seems to mostly be a case of her stopping long before the other two did, either in practice or in her lessons.  Either way, she had the potential to reach the same level as them, but just isn't there.

That can be argued. It could of been that Tochi just wanted to know more about his rival(Yusaku) by studying his wife with a pretext that he's giving her disguise lessons. No one can know why Tochi decided to give those lessons unless we get a flash back or something similar.

Either way, she had the potential to reach the same level as them, but just isn't there.

I can tell here you want to say the right answer that she doesn't have the natural talent but the Yukiko fan in you stops you.
I'll stick to my guns and say that even if Yukiko never stopped practicing(which we don't know, all we know is that she retired from acting, she could of still continued to practice) she still wouldn't have reached the level of the other two. She says it herself " I can't do it as perfectly as Sharon" which implies even back then went both of them were putting similar practice time into their disguises, Sharon still outclassed her. I think that Yukiko is at her peak right now, being able to disguise herself as the average female, which again, is an impressive thing.
..Plus I have Shinichi on my side, who would know better than her own son.