Demon Dog Case (734-740)

[Chekhov MacGuffin]

I didn't think there was enough grass at the cliffside to  burn in such a consistent pattern. The road looked like mostly dirt. That's what led me to believe in the first place that an outside fuel source that wasn't grass was necessary. It would have been very nice if Heiji said the grass was burning so we had some idea of what the fuel was.

Heiji did say the grass was burning.

But it sure would have been nice to know it was all grass burning and not some bare patches.

It was dark out, so they didn't notice the lighters.  Remember that it was only the GAS switch from the lighter that was held in the "on" position.  Like when you have a Bic lighter and you only depress the black part.
So the fire wouldn't have moved away...  Only the lighters would have, you know?

I still think they should have been able to see the lighters on the ground if they could see well enough to walk outside without a flashlight. Also, if the on switch of the lighter is pressed down so it's always on, wouldn't it still be burning after setting the grass alight, thus creating "another" set of tracks that run away? The girls did say they saw fire jumping about and making sounds, which suggests the saw and heard the burning lighter chain as it was pulled away. It seems they should have mentioned the fire was moving away from them.

[Abs.]

I'm not picky.  The only part that really bugged me was Takako's name changes.

Clearly an error from the third file on, and at the last minute they changed it back when they were discussing the parts of the kanji characters with the image in the background - that is, they changed it for the IMAGE, but not in the speech bubble right next to it *facepalm*  (Please see the raw for details.)

Thankfully this is not an issue in our English version, because (hahaha) none of that kanji stuff makes any sense in the English version in the first place!

[sstimson]

Spoiler:

I think, yeah, that's what he meant...  The dirt blocked the outlets and/or covered the lighters.

And I got no clue for the flames getting larger (or the flaming dog appearing to get bigger, although that is probably just an illusion due to fear).

I Got a theory about that. Railway Illusion. Two lines seeming parallel but really slanting toward each other. An Artist trick .

[Abs.]

I Got a theory about that. Railway Illusion. Two lines seeming parallel but really slanting toward each other. An Artist trick .

No no no...  Conan and Heiji were the ones who mentioned it, so it was a fact for the characters as well as the reader.

Spoiler:

As you know, Conan and Heiji are not easily taken in by illusions.

[sstimson]

I Got a theory about that. Railway Illusion. Two lines seeming parallel but really slanting toward each other. An Artist trick .

No no no...  Conan and Heiji were the ones who mentioned it, so it was a fact for the characters as well as the reader.

Spoiler:

As you know, Conan and Heiji are not easily taken in by illusions.

Note the illusion above and then read those words. Also note that if the Cliff side is 'B' the picture of the holder of the rall appears larger then it appearance at 'A'. Also he was not just making this observation to Heiji and might have colored the truth.

[Chekhov MacGuffin]

Spoiler:

I think, yeah, that's what he meant...  The dirt blocked the outlets and/or covered the lighters.
And I got no clue for the flames getting larger (or the flaming dog appearing to get bigger, although that is probably just an illusion due to fear).

I Got a theory about that. Railway Illusion. Two lines seeming parallel but really slanting toward each other. An Artist trick .

Spoiler:

This illusion really has nothing to to with the case at all. Unless the fire was hanging on wires right in front of their faces and they somehow lost the sense of depth perception, it doesn't mean anything. These sorts of illusions don't take to 3-D well (except for very distant things, but that's irrelevant as the fire was within 50 feet of them anyway.)

I wonder if Aoyama changed the solution last minute since its current incarnation has quite a flew flaws. Also, the name change error is pretty weird. Maybe he was distracted by the world cup. I blame it on the vuvuzelas.

[Abs.]

I Got a theory about that. Railway Illusion. Two lines seeming parallel but really slanting toward each other. An Artist trick .

No no no...  Conan and Heiji were the ones who mentioned it, so it was a fact for the characters as well as the reader.

Spoiler:

As you know, Conan and Heiji are not easily taken in by illusions.

Note the illusion above and then read those words. Also note that if the Cliff side is 'B' the picture of the holder of the rall appears larger then it appearance at 'A'. Also he was not just making this observation to Heiji and might have colored the truth.

sstimson: The reason why people hardly ever reply to you is that we don't understand what you are saying.

What are you trying to say in this bolded sentence?

[caribou]

hmm I guess the solution isn't perfect (and I'm not sure I fully comprehend it...) but it'll do for me. the part about the fire moving away and Ran & Kazuha not noticing, I'd blame it mostly on their panic. I suppose if the dog was going very fast it might have just looked like the flaming footprints that were further away were dying out as the dog was running past.

[Nyarl]

I didn't think there was enough grass at the cliffside to  burn in such a consistent pattern. The road looked like mostly dirt. That's what led me to believe in the first place that an outside fuel source that wasn't grass was necessary. It would have been very nice if Heiji said the grass was burning so we had some idea of what the fuel was.

Heiji did say the grass was burning.

But it sure would have been nice to know it was all grass burning and not some bare patches.

It was dark out, so they didn't notice the lighters.  Remember that it was only the GAS switch from the lighter that was held in the "on" position.  Like when you have a Bic lighter and you only depress the black part.
So the fire wouldn't have moved away...  Only the lighters would have, you know?

I still think they should have been able to see the lighters on the ground if they could see well enough to walk outside without a flashlight. Also, if the on switch of the lighter is pressed down so it's always on, wouldn't it still be burning after setting the grass alight, thus creating "another" set of tracks that run away? The girls did say they saw fire jumping about and making sounds, which suggests the saw and heard the burning lighter chain as it was pulled away. It seems they should have mentioned the fire was moving away from them.

Not sure what you mean about the lighters being pulled away. You think the line would catch on a pole/bush/stone/something so the whole line would be dragged at once? A long lax line** tied only to the dog (or the ring the dog was {to} carry in its mouth... whatever) would be relatively stationary* at the points where the dog runs past, and for a bit after until those points would start to drag along with the rest of the line. There would also be an increased span of time between when the dog passes a point along the line and when that point is dragged as the dog approaches the end of the line. Maybe that explains the "bigger" flames. More time for a lit lighter to burn the grass around it before it, presumably, is put out by being dragged by the dog (doesn't explain the increasing distance between singe marks, though).

* The lit lighters could of course be jostled around a bit as the line/other lighters brushed over them.
** Hmm, just noticed/remembered it's supposedly piano wire again... I don't see how that'd work, since that's not going to be loose/lax enough at all... ETA: Though, the line Heiji is actually holding looks lax enough.  

[Abs.]

Wait, okay...  After the dog reached the ring placed at the end of his run route, he would pick it up using his mouth and drag the entire line of lighters away.

When it says "catch on the rough patches of ground" or whatever, it meant that the lighters would basically be tumbling about as they were dragged and make lots of noise as they hit each other and the ground, etc.

Yeah, I still don't have an explanation for the bigger flames or the increasing distance.

[Nyarl]

Ah, wait, oops. Just went over 738 again. The girls said they saw the flames moving after they came out again, not while they were fleeing the dog. Forgot/didn't note that. I guess the dog did recover the ring at the end of the line, rather than start with the ring like I assumed. The girls were vague about how the flames were moving.

[sstimson]

I Got a theory about that. Railway Illusion. Two lines seeming parallel but really slanting toward each other. An Artist trick .

No no no...  Conan and Heiji were the ones who mentioned it, so it was a fact for the characters as well as the reader.

Spoiler:

As you know, Conan and Heiji are not easily taken in by illusions.

Note the illusion above and then read those words. Also note that if the Cliff side is 'B' the picture of the holder of the rall appears larger then it appearance at 'A'. Also he was not just making this observation to Heiji and might have colored the truth.

sstimson: The reason why people hardly ever reply to you is that we don't understand what you are saying.

What are you trying to say in this bolded sentence?

Ok I will try to be clearer.

First my point was the after fire ( the results [likely set up before hand] of the "Demon Dog ) are set up like the above illusion. In the picture the larger items are in the foreground ( In this case near the cliff ) and they get smaller as you get father away. That alone shows this is trick on a person's eyes. If is was real then all after fire's would be the same size and the same distance apart.

The illusion I was referring to is not same size A and B point. It is the trick an artist uses to suggest distance. They draw a road or a train track that starts far apart and gets closer together as you move toward the top of the page the artist has drawn on. In really, there are only a few feet in distance between the top and bottom of the artist road, but because of the way they draw it, it looks much father.

Now for this phase:  Also he was not just making this observation to Heiji and might have colored the truth.

If Conan was only talking to Heiji, then he need not worry about the emotional state of his listener. or worry about giving away too information about the investigation that a possible culprit might be able to use to their advantage. Here that is not the case. While Conan is talking to Heiji, he does have audience. As we know from earlier cases, Ran and Kazuka DO NOT like ghost! He need to be carefull not to scare them. We also have Miyuki, a possible culprit. What I am saying is Conan knowing his audience would very likely keep certain things back and maybe change a few facts to not fall in to the above trap ( worry about the emotional state of his listener. or worry about giving away too information about the investigation that a possible culprit might be able to use to their advantage ). Yes when I say Color the truth I mean lie and I just explained why. I think it might be a different Comment if only Heiji was there.

That said a few questions

1) Since the trick was set up before hand, what caused the lighters to light? They could not stay lite all the time so something must start them.
2) That said next the next question is what would cause then to stop, or are they just allowed to run down ( run out of fuel )?
3) If they are indeed lighters, a small hole to place them in should still be there after the lighter themselves are collected. was that mentioned?

[Misztina]

I did not quite enjoy this long case. Maybe because I expected some scenes which actualy add something to the series, okay we had a slightly susicious Ran, and an informative Kogoro, but... . The mystery was nice, but, yeah I was kinda lost this time.

[Abs.]

1) Since the trick was set up before hand, what caused the lighters to light? They could not stay lite all the time so something must start them.
2) That said next the next question is what would cause then to stop, or are they just allowed to run down ( run out of fuel )?
3) If they are indeed lighters, a small hole to place them in should still be there after the lighter themselves are collected. was that mentioned?

Spoiler:

1.  It says that the lighters were manipulated so that they would stay lit.
2.  It doesn't matter if they were still putting out gas or not, because the gas is invisible.
3.  The lighters needn't be placed in holes or indentations.

[Introuble]

just to clarify things. are you guys telling me that this extremely long case ends up horribly. seeing how long this will be in the anime....meh...that sucks. looks like people will have to spend a month watxhing a long case with a bad result.