NEED CRITICS for my NOVEL

If you have some randomness to share that you can't post elsewhere, this is the place to do it.
sstimson
Everyone a Critic

Posts:
2588
Contact:

Re: NEED CRITICS for my NOVEL

Post by sstimson »

Kor wrote:
sstimson wrote: There is a problem about is called cause / effect

You go back in time to fix a problem and you succeed. So The problem you went back to fix never happened.


But if that is the cases why did you go back in time to fix a problem that never happened. And how would you know you need to go back to fix the problem that never happened if it never happened.

You have created a time Paradox
In fiction, usually this paradox is ignored.
Akonyl wrote: b) While grandfather paradoxes may exist in time travel, you can easily explain them away by either using multiple timelines,
If I recall correctly, this was how it worked in DBZ. Trunks could only change the "present" timeline, but his actions in the present, couldn't change his timeline (the future).

In Sailor Moon (the anime) however, many things should probably have changed in the future, but only at the start of Sailor Stars Chibiusa was about to disappear. I believe though that it had the concept of "Time can fix itself and not effect heavilly on the future" so only real drastic events (like somebody dying) would change the future.

Both seem like good options to me, aside from the flaws. Option one can become complicated and option two is a very easy way to go and it also says that the universe goes in a specific road, and if something happens, the universe will somehow fix it in order to not slide from the certain road.
If that is so, how does one know on what time line they belong.

By the way there is may be a third way.

A time travel visited a different time line and does what he was suppose to.
In the time line he edited that is what he was to do
His own time line is unchanged
Later

Invisible Member
Spoiler: SS Present from PT
Image
Kor
Administrator

Posts:
3051

Re: NEED CRITICS for my NOVEL

Post by Kor »

sstimson wrote: A time travel visited a different time line and does what he was suppose to.
In the time line he edited that is what he was to do
His own time line is unchanged
that's the DBZ way which I said above.
Image
sstimson
Everyone a Critic

Posts:
2588
Contact:

Re: NEED CRITICS for my NOVEL

Post by sstimson »

Kor wrote:
sstimson wrote: A time travel visited a different time line and does what he was suppose to.
In the time line he edited that is what he was to do
His own time line is unchanged
that's the DBZ way which I said above.
yes and no.

You are talking one part of the time line be it Past Present or Future - Same time lines at different times

My time travel visitor has say His time. He has a His Past, a His Present, and a His Future.
He visited say DBZ time. That is completely out of His Time Line not really part of His Past, Present, or Future
He makes a change in say DBZ Past. This change is not a prt of His Time Line. This change the Visitor makes only effects DBZ time not at all His Time Be it His Past, His Present, or His Future. While he is Visiting DBZ time, he is completely out of His time. When he Goes back  to his time line he leaves the DBZ line completely. You might say the Visitor is from a Parallel Timeline.
Later

Invisible Member
Spoiler: SS Present from PT
Image
User avatar
Laurell

Posts:
69

Re: NEED CRITICS for my NOVEL

Post by Laurell »

As I read your posts, I guess some of you have much MORE complex ideas about time traveling. Well, I'm not going to propose any theory about that. But in my novel, don't expect that once you tried to change the past, the coming events will also change. What if there is something that will prevent any changes from the past to affect the future? Well, I'm open to any comment that anyone might give.
Kor
Administrator

Posts:
3051

Re: NEED CRITICS for my NOVEL

Post by Kor »

sstimson wrote:
Kor wrote:
sstimson wrote: A time travel visited a different time line and does what he was suppose to.
In the time line he edited that is what he was to do
His own time line is unchanged
that's the DBZ way which I said above.
yes and no.

You are talking one part of the time line be it Past Present or Future - Same time lines at different times

My time travel visitor has say His time. He has a His Past, a His Present, and a His Future.
He visited say DBZ time. That is completely out of His Time Line not really part of His Past, Present, or Future
He makes a change in say DBZ Past. This change is not a prt of His Time Line. This change the Visitor makes only effects DBZ time not at all His Time Be it His Past, His Present, or His Future. While he is Visiting DBZ time, he is completely out of His time. When he Goes back  to his time line he leaves the DBZ line completely. You might say the Visitor is from a Parallel Timeline.
Well then, that's not time travelling. It's travelling through dimenssions, in which case, Tsubasa Chronicle and the western drama series - Sliders, have already used this idea.


Laurell wrote: As I read your posts, I guess some of you have much MORE complex ideas about time traveling. Well, I'm not going to propose any theory about that. But in my novel, don't expect that once you tried to change the past, the coming events will also change. What if there is something that will prevent any changes from the past to affect the future? Well, I'm open to any comment that anyone might give.
I think you need to keep this as simple as possible. Don't make the reader's head hurt. It's your settings and your story, so what you say goes as a fact, even if it doesn't make any sense. If you're looking for an easy way out of "if you change something in the past, it will affect the future" then I think the "the universe fixes itself" is the best option to go.
Image
User avatar
Laurell

Posts:
69

Re: NEED CRITICS for my NOVEL

Post by Laurell »

I posted the synopsis. Feel free to leave some comments!  :)
User avatar
Kleene Onigiri
Community Rice Warrior
*punches Akonyl*

Posts:
2479

Re: NEED CRITICS for my NOVEL

Post by Kleene Onigiri »

Laurell wrote: Synopsis

Year 2019, the year when time traveling is proven, Philippines is finally a developed country with no debts in other nations, thanks to the support from an organization known as the "Paradigmatic Ordinal." Everything was peaceful and prosperous at that time. Until one day, something terrible happened. The head of the Ordinal, known as the First, was found dead and the power was given to the man known as the Seventh. That marked the end of the peaceful days. The Seventh grabbed the power from the government and proclaimed himself as the new president of the Republic. The country fell into chaos. Everything is hopeless until the superiors of the Ordinal, who opposes the way of the Seventh, sent an agent to the past in order to change the future.
Maybe it's because it's a sort summary. But I think you should say why the agent was send to the past. What I mean is that the seventh became the president. But you didn't say anything about other methods used before that. Like trying to make a revolution or killing the seventh.
"The seventh became president -> "oh crap" -> need to send agent to the past" sounds unlogical. Instead you should make it more like: "Seventh became president -> people tried to stop him -> seventh is to powerful -> last resort is sending a agent to the past" sounds more reasonable.
And in a mystery logic/reason is a big and important aspect. So imo, even such "trivial" things need to be pointed out/done logically.
The agent named Erald successfully arrived to the past where he met two students who will later help him on his quest. As soon as he told them about the gruesome future that awaits them, he decided to enroll at Joseph C. Felicia University, one of the elite universities in the country, where the Ordinal was founded. Unfortunately, he found no clues about the Ordinal until he stumbled upon a case that might lead him to what he is looking for. Days after, he decided to form a Detective Club to solve cases happening around the campus and to track down the Ordinal, which has been behind the curtains in some incidents. He also met other students with deductive capabilities and together, they solve cases.
I find that main characters name a bit strange XD but that's my personal opinion.
If I remember correctly, you wanted to make it a bit similar to APTX. Since Erald is time traveling, will he become younger too? Or does he look young enough with 29 or older to be able to become a student? (tho I guess he should look young enough)

Noting else to add to that part. Since it doesn't have much info either.
The time finally came when a man who called himself as the First, but the group's name is not that of the Ordinal, sent a challenge notice to the Detective Club. The First aims to test the deductive capabilities of Erald and the others through playing a real-life Mafia game. Little does the Detective Club know that the First's pieces have been already set even before the notice was given.

In the future, the Seventh has learned the escape of Erald and has dispatched his elite squad known as the Seven Cardinals to annihilate Erald, thus preventing any changes from the past to occur in the future. Erald's and the others' lives were put in danger through assassination attempts. Once the real threat arrives, will Erald still be able to do what he's supposed to?
What's Erald supposed to do? Kill the seventh? Warn the first? Try not to kill the seventh but hindering him to get the power? Changing the system of the ordinal so that the seventh can't get the power?
Image
Keyhole drawn by Yuri Iwamoto <3
Spoiler: Secret Santa gift from Commi-Ninja <3
A Black Organization Christmas Carol (need to fix the link)
3DS Friend Code: 4141 3202 3514

༼ つ ◕_◕ ༽つ Giff holidays
User avatar
Laurell

Posts:
69

Re: NEED CRITICS for my NOVEL

Post by Laurell »

Kleene Onigiri wrote:
Laurell wrote: Synopsis

Year 2019, the year when time traveling is proven, Philippines is finally a developed country with no debts in other nations, thanks to the support from an organization known as the "Paradigmatic Ordinal." Everything was peaceful and prosperous at that time. Until one day, something terrible happened. The head of the Ordinal, known as the First, was found dead and the power was given to the man known as the Seventh. That marked the end of the peaceful days. The Seventh grabbed the power from the government and proclaimed himself as the new president of the Republic. The country fell into chaos. Everything is hopeless until the superiors of the Ordinal, who opposes the way of the Seventh, sent an agent to the past in order to change the future.
Maybe it's because it's a sort summary. But I think you should say why the agent was send to the past. What I mean is that the seventh became the president. But you didn't say anything about other methods used before that. Like trying to make a revolution or killing the seventh.
"The seventh became president -> "oh crap" -> need to send agent to the past" sounds unlogical. Instead you should make it more like: "Seventh became president -> people tried to stop him -> seventh is to powerful -> last resort is sending a agent to the past" sounds more reasonable.
And in a mystery logic/reason is a big and important aspect. So imo, even such "trivial" things need to be pointed out/done logically.
The agent named Erald successfully arrived to the past where he met two students who will later help him on his quest. As soon as he told them about the gruesome future that awaits them, he decided to enroll at Joseph C. Felicia University, one of the elite universities in the country, where the Ordinal was founded. Unfortunately, he found no clues about the Ordinal until he stumbled upon a case that might lead him to what he is looking for. Days after, he decided to form a Detective Club to solve cases happening around the campus and to track down the Ordinal, which has been behind the curtains in some incidents. He also met other students with deductive capabilities and together, they solve cases.
I find that main characters name a bit strange XD but that's my personal opinion.
If I remember correctly, you wanted to make it a bit similar to APTX. Since Erald is time traveling, will he become younger too? Or does he look young enough with 29 or older to be able to become a student? (tho I guess he should look young enough)

Noting else to add to that part. Since it doesn't have much info either.
The time finally came when a man who called himself as the First, but the group's name is not that of the Ordinal, sent a challenge notice to the Detective Club. The First aims to test the deductive capabilities of Erald and the others through playing a real-life Mafia game. Little does the Detective Club know that the First's pieces have been already set even before the notice was given.

In the future, the Seventh has learned the escape of Erald and has dispatched his elite squad known as the Seven Cardinals to annihilate Erald, thus preventing any changes from the past to occur in the future. Erald's and the others' lives were put in danger through assassination attempts. Once the real threat arrives, will Erald still be able to do what he's supposed to?
What's Erald supposed to do? Kill the seventh? Warn the first? Try not to kill the seventh but hindering him to get the power? Changing the system of the ordinal so that the seventh can't get the power?
I haven't put much info into the synopsis. The thing that can answer your questions will be on the Prologue, like how the Seventh got the power or what Erald is supposed to do.
User avatar
caribou

Posts:
269
Contact:

Re: NEED CRITICS for my NOVEL

Post by caribou »

that sounds interesting. i like time-travel stories because writers seem to take one of 3 stands everytime: 1) The past is unchangeable, whatever you do everything will automatically work out to the same outcome. 2) You SHOULD NOT change the past, because it will lead to catastrophic mess. 3) Your actions influence the outcomes and you can change the past. ... So I'm curious to see which stand you'll take :) will you be posting your story online for people to read?
"Shh! Celebrate after the curtain of this bloody stage closes."

Image
User avatar
Laurell

Posts:
69

Re: NEED CRITICS for my NOVEL

Post by Laurell »

caribou wrote: that sounds interesting. i like time-travel stories because writers seem to take one of 3 stands everytime: 1) The past is unchangeable, whatever you do everything will automatically work out to the same outcome. 2) You SHOULD NOT change the past, because it will lead to catastrophic mess. 3) Your actions influence the outcomes and you can change the past. ... So I'm curious to see which stand you'll take :) will you be posting your story online for people to read?
I'm planning to post it here. And I wanted to know what the people here think (since DCTP is the domain of mystery lovers) about it before I publish it. If my mystery cases will not be easy-to-crack, then, I'll go on with my original plan.
Kor
Administrator

Posts:
3051

Re: NEED CRITICS for my NOVEL

Post by Kor »

how are you planning to publish it? self-publishing (a big headhache in my opinion) or through a publishing house?
Image
Post Reply