Target Located: What is going on in Gin's head?

[Abs.]

Did he figure out that Scar Akai isn't Akai?

That's the only thing I can come up with as far as why he didn't blow Kir to smithereens.

You think about it, it's WAY too suspicious that:
1) Akai wouldn't fight back, or even try to escape from Kir when she shot him.
2) Akai would fall for Kir's "trap" in the first place, without having some sort of plan in place.

Or, if Gin thinks that somehow everything was done without Kir's knowledge: HOW IN THE HELL.  SHE SHOT HIS FRICKEN HEAD.

[Chekhov MacGuffin]

The debate about methods Akai may have used to fake his death has been gone over pretty extensively in the main Akai thread. Start reading from this post. The reasoning goes on for a couple of pages.
As for myself, I think it is pretty telling that Gin hasn't blown Kir's head off by now. To me Gin's actions strongly suggest he doesn't think Scar Akai is the real deal. There is some good evidence suggesting that scar Akai isn't Akai. (bottom of page) As I understand it, Gin's line about a detective was a reference to the conversation earlier where Kir had brought up Sherlock Holmes. In my reading, it seems an awful lot like a confirmation, albeit vague, that Gin thinks scar Akai is Bourbon...

Spoiler:

Spoiler:

Spoiler:

As for how Gin figured it out, he saw through Vermouth instantly when she dressed up as a waiter in a nightclub. It kind of fits with his whole "instinct" detective style.

File 704 seems to not be in the DCTP online viewer by the way although it has departed from the main page.

[Abs.]

The debate about methods Akai may have used to fake his death has been gone over pretty extensively in the main Akai thread. Start reading from this post. The reasoning goes on for a couple of pages.
As for myself, I think it is pretty telling that Gin hasn't blown Kir's head off by now. To me Gin's actions strongly suggest he doesn't think Scar Akai is the real deal. There is some good evidence suggesting that scar Akai isn't Akai. (bottom of page) As I understand it, Gin's line about a detective was a reference to the conversation earlier where Kir had brought up Sherlock Holmes. In my reading, it seems an awful lot like a confirmation, albeit vague, that Gin thinks scar Akai is Bourbon...

Spoiler:

Spoiler:

Spoiler:

As for how Gin figured it out, he saw through Vermouth instantly when she dressed up as a waiter in a nightclub. It kind of fits with his whole "instinct" detective style.

Hey.  Meant to reply to this, but got distracted when I realized that I didn't read all the pages in the links you gave when I went through them the first time...

Anyhow.  The question was specifically about things from Gin's point of view... and Gin doesn't know everything we know about Scar Akai.  Basically, if I were Gin, I would know that the circumstances of Akai's death were suspicious (unless I was too blinded by glee while things were going down) and then at first hint that Akai was still alive, blast Kir to smithereens first, ask questions later.

Also.  I'm not completely convinced that Gin figured Vermouth out instantly.  I'm more on the side where he figured it out after she opened her mouth.  Also, his "instinct" when he saw Skai (that was a typo, but I'm keeping it) was that it was indeed Akai.

File 704 seems to not be in the DCTP online viewer by the way although it has departed from the main page.

This part of your post I still have no idea what you're talking about.  It's not in the Manga Viewer sidebar, but it's still on the home page, after the "Kobayashi-sensei's Love" section and the update post.

[Chekhov MacGuffin]

Anyhow.  The question was specifically about things from Gin's point of view... and Gin doesn't know everything we know about Scar Akai.  Basically, if I were Gin, I would know that the circumstances of Akai's death were suspicious (unless I was too blinded by glee while things were going down) and then at first hint that Akai was still alive, blast Kir to smithereens first, ask questions later.

Gin doesn't know about some of the suspicious circumstances that the readers do like the mysterious changing blood trails. I think he assumed Akai was indeed dead until Vodka brought up the appearance of someone who looked like Akai on the bank heist tape. Also, when Kir pointed out all the circumstances that would seem to suggest that it would be impossible to fake, Gin's couldn't come up with a satisfactory response to Kir's question of how Akai's death could be faked in front of him.

Spoiler:

As for why Gin doesn't kill Kir simply for being suspicious, I don't have a good answer for that. I think that perhaps Gin is adverse to killing a loyal agent who had gained the boss's recognition without evidence of treachery. From Gin's point of view, if she is loyal, she did a great service to the org by getting rid of Akai. I'd like to think Gin has some pride as a detective too and would prefer to clearly discover the truth rather than kill Kir preemptively and be forever unsure.

Also.  I'm not completely convinced that Gin figured Vermouth out instantly.  I'm more on the side where he figured it out after she opened her mouth.  Also, his "instinct" when he saw Skai (that was a typo, but I'm keeping it) was that it was indeed Akai.

Valid point. Gin had less evidence to use when he tried to figure out who scar Akai was than when he figured out the waiter was Vermouth. The difference between the situations is that Gin was on the look out for scar Akai while I assume he had no idea Vermouth was coming. Regardless, Gin picked Vermouth out really quickly, since her only interaction with Gin was to offer him and Vodka drinks.
Gin did think "Akai Shuuichi" when he saw scar Akai, but my interpretation was that was a confirmation on Gin's part that the person was Akai or was someone disguised as Akai Shuuichi rather than a random doppelgänger. The "lowering the gun from Kir's head" point suggests that Gin's final call was that it wasn't Akai.

This part of your post I still have no idea what you're talking about.  It's not in the Manga Viewer sidebar, but it's still on the home page, after the "Kobayashi-sensei's Love" section and the update post.

Clearly I have no idea what I'm talking about either. It was on the main page after all. I shouldn't post while sleep deprived...

[Abs.]

Anyhow.  The question was specifically about things from Gin's point of view... and Gin doesn't know everything we know about Scar Akai.  Basically, if I were Gin, I would know that the circumstances of Akai's death were suspicious (unless I was too blinded by glee while things were going down) and then at first hint that Akai was still alive, blast Kir to smithereens first, ask questions later.

Gin doesn't know about some of the suspicious circumstances that the readers do like the mysterious changing blood trails. I think he assumed Akai was indeed dead until Vodka brought up the appearance of someone who looked like Akai on the bank heist tape. Also, when Kir pointed out all the circumstances that would seem to suggest that it would be impossible to fake, Gin's couldn't come up with a satisfactory response to Kir's question of how Akai's death could be faked in front of him.

Spoiler:

I'm referring to just the two suspicious points I noted above:

You think about it, it's WAY too suspicious that:
1) Akai wouldn't fight back, or even try to escape from Kir when she shot him.
2) Akai would fall for Kir's "trap" in the first place, without having some sort of plan in place.

But I do get it... when asked like that, it does seem rather unbelievable that Akai or Akai+Kir would have been able to come up with something that would have fooled Gin when 1) he was watching the entire time (albeit through a monitor), and 2) there was so little time to escape without being seen.  But it still doesn't satisfy the two mysteries I noted above.  Even if Akai's death were real, these two points seem like it would point more toward Kir being a plant.

Also.  I'm not completely convinced that Gin figured Vermouth out instantly.  I'm more on the side where he figured it out after she opened her mouth.  Also, his "instinct" when he saw Skai (that was a typo, but I'm keeping it) was that it was indeed Akai.

Valid point. Gin had less evidence to use when he tried to figure out who scar Akai was than when he figured out the waiter was Vermouth. The difference between the situations is that Gin was on the look out for scar Akai while I assume he had no idea Vermouth was coming. Regardless, Gin picked Vermouth out really quickly, since her only interaction with Gin was to offer him and Vodka drinks.

Really, I believe the drink choice and the unlikeliness of it having come from the singer were pretty much dead giveaways.  Not for Vodka though - but we all know Vodka pretty much just takes things at face value.

Gin did think "Akai Shuuichi" when he saw scar Akai, but my interpretation was that was a confirmation on Gin's part that the person was Akai or was someone disguised as Akai Shuuichi rather than a random doppelgänger. The "lowering the gun from Kir's head" point suggests that Gin's final call was that it wasn't Akai.

Ok, so we are going on this as very, very likely then:
1) Gin knows that Scar Akai is Bourbon, or at the very least that Scar Akai is an ally.
2) Gin at this point has no evidence to suggest that Akai is still alive - thus no shooting of Kir.

This part of your post I still have no idea what you're talking about.  It's not in the Manga Viewer sidebar, but it's still on the home page, after the "Kobayashi-sensei's Love" section and the update post.

Clearly I have no idea what I'm talking about either. It was on the main page after all. I shouldn't post while sleep deprived...

I only brought it up because it seemed that you had almost changed this part of your post, but then left it alone.  We all shouldn't post while sleep deprived... but it happens more often than we'd like, I'm sure.  

[Misztina]

i can't believe that nobody's interested about gin's remarks at file 700.....

I'm interested in that. But somehow this whole Gin-Kogoro-Conan suspicion is not that interesting to others. ^^" Anyways I'd like to talk about it, but this thread is specifically about something else.
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As for why didn't Gin kill the suspicious Kir: Even if he'd love to, Gin just can't go around and shot eveyone who seems to be suspicious. The main reason is that the boss wouldn't allow it. They might be short on pro BO members too. I mean it takes time to get a trustworthy member.
Another thing is, suspicion is not enough. Sure the situation is a bit fishy, but Gin is aware of that overthing and overcomplicating the situation will not lead anywhere. So he waits. That's the key point. He waits for a mistake or another suspicious move from the enemy, if there is one. Gin won't jump on a shadow (wonder if that expression exists in English, oh well...) he is a tactitian.
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Why Akai didn't fight back or escape? I think Gosho would answer that: "because it is cool this way". It was meaningless to escape from kir after she shot him, since he couldn't just jump back into hjis car and drive away at top speed, because by he gets into the car he gets shot a few more times. About fighting back... maybe he could have carried a gun, that's true.

Sorry for the typos, I'm kinda tired. ^^"

[mangaluva]

IMHO, Kir and Akai were up to something. I'm not going into all the reasons since they've been done to death in another thread, I know, but I think if nothing else Aoyama-sensei's love of detective trivia and the fact that he "died" at "Reiha" Falls ought to be enough. Though I'm not convinced that scar Akai is the real Akai.

As for Gin, I think that he's suspicious, but he knows that he doesn't have enough to go on- and Kir is trusted by the Boss, something that he probably regards as sacrosanct. He can't kill her until he has absolute proof of deception. I don't doubt that he really WANTS to kill her, but he also really wants to kill Vermouth and Kogoro and kami knows how many people.