Discussion Thread - File 898 : Who is Rum & Scotch? And who is Vermouth for Anokata?

Forum reserved for discussing specific points of the story—mostly from the manga. Be warned, these discussions will be current with the manga and will spoil many plot lines for anime-centric fans.
User avatar
Detective Doroshi
When you face a fact, always ask you the questions 'why' and 'how'? This will always lead you in the good way.

Posts:
39

Discussion Thread - File 898 : Who is Rum & Scotch? And who is Vermouth for Anokata?

Post by Detective Doroshi »

Spoiler:
I still don't know if my theory is good, but as for Scotch, I was thinking that he/she might be Wataru Date. The fact that Akai-san does not have any Scotch drinks in his cupboard, might be as a sign of respect for a deceased friend (who might have infiltrated the BO)
But as for Rum, we don't have any real information on him/her. Only that is he is very close to Anokata.
About Vermouth, I have got the suspicion that she might be Anokata's mother or any other close relative.The unknown grief she holds against Haibara Ai could it be associated to it? That could be a possibility. But the fact that she protects Shinichi and Haibara as children must probably be associated to the fact that she is close to Anokata.
Private Detective
User avatar
Elixir

Posts:
144

Re: Discussion Thread - File 889 : Who is Rum & Scotch? And who is Vermouth for Anokata?

Post by Elixir »

Scotch would be the person that Akai assassinated to prove his worth to BO (obeyed higher ups order). Scotch is akin to Ethan Hondou, as Amuro is Hidemi, in terms of infiltrating. Rum hasn't appeared yet. I prefer him to have army training for a change.

And of course, Vermouth is Anokata's
Spoiler:
favourite ;)
User 4869

Posts:
597

Re: Discussion Thread - File 889 : Who is Rum & Scotch? And who is Vermouth for Anokata?

Post by User 4869 »

Someone really has to make a Date-Scotch timeline and Akai-Amuro timeline for easy read, really.
User avatar
Detective Doroshi
When you face a fact, always ask you the questions 'why' and 'how'? This will always lead you in the good way.

Posts:
39

Re: Discussion Thread - File 889 : Who is Rum & Scotch? And who is Vermouth for Anokata?

Post by Detective Doroshi »

Elixir wrote:Scotch would be the person that Akai assassinated to prove his worth to BO (obeyed higher ups order). Scotch is akin to Ethan Hondou, as Amuro is Hidemi, in terms of infiltrating. Rum hasn't appeared yet. I prefer him to have army training for a change.

And of course, Vermouth is Anokata's
Spoiler:
favourite ;)
But do you think that Akai would accept to assassinate someone just like this (probably without his consent)? I personally can't believe that Rei would have allowed him like that, if he too was present at that moment. Wouldn't have Rei immediately killed Akai for doing so? Or it might be possible that at that time, Rei didn't know that Akai was infiltrating as well. So if he had killed Akai, the BO might have known that Rei was infiltrating as well. Thus what you are saying might probably be true. :)
And the more is that Rei and Akai himself still grief for that person. But what we know is that Scotch must probably (I guess) the "him" Akai was talking about to Rei over the phone. (I believe. Not still sure ^^")
Private Detective
User avatar
Detective Doroshi
When you face a fact, always ask you the questions 'why' and 'how'? This will always lead you in the good way.

Posts:
39

Re: Discussion Thread - File 889 : Who is Rum & Scotch? And who is Vermouth for Anokata?

Post by Detective Doroshi »

User 4869 wrote:Someone really has to make a Date-Scotch timeline and Akai-Amuro timeline for easy read, really.
Yes, I think that it's becoming more and more complicated in connecting infiltrated BO members with one another. ^^"
Private Detective
Shinichi Edogawa

Posts:
104

Re: Discussion Thread - File 889 : Who is Rum & Scotch? And who is Vermouth for Anokata?

Post by Shinichi Edogawa »

If Vermouth is Anokata's mother, the way he talked to her in volume 42 is strange for a son.
User 4869

Posts:
597

Re: Discussion Thread - File 889 : Who is Rum & Scotch? And who is Vermouth for Anokata?

Post by User 4869 »

Detective Doroshi wrote:
User 4869 wrote:Someone really has to make a Date-Scotch timeline and Akai-Amuro timeline for easy read, really.
Yes, I think that it's becoming more and more complicated in connecting infiltrated BO members with one another. ^^"
No. Simplest thing is.
Akai leave BO 2 years ago. His rivalry with Amuro start before that.
Date dies one years ago. Moreover, Amuro learn that just a few days/months earlier.
User avatar
Elixir

Posts:
144

Re: Discussion Thread - File 889 : Who is Rum & Scotch? And who is Vermouth for Anokata?

Post by Elixir »

Detective Doroshi wrote:
Elixir wrote:Scotch would be the person that Akai assassinated to prove his worth to BO (obeyed higher ups order). Scotch is akin to Ethan Hondou, as Amuro is Hidemi, in terms of infiltrating. Rum hasn't appeared yet. I prefer him to have army training for a change.

And of course, Vermouth is Anokata's
Spoiler:
favourite ;)
But do you think that Akai would accept to assassinate someone just like this (probably without his consent)? I personally can't believe that Rei would have allowed him like that, if he too was present at that moment. Wouldn't have Rei immediately killed Akai for doing so? Or it might be possible that at that time, Rei didn't know that Akai was infiltrating as well. So if he had killed Akai, the BO might have known that Rei was infiltrating as well. Thus what you are saying might probably be true. :)
And the more is that Rei and Akai himself still grief for that person. But what we know is that Scotch must probably (I guess) the "him" Akai was talking about to Rei over the phone. (I believe. Not still sure ^^")
Well that explains the deep hatred towards Akai. I think they both know or sense that they are both spies. And what's the purpose of infiltration to the BO if you are not capable of doing what you are ordered to. And Akai might be the person in FBI who can stomach that kind of assignment. What I meant is that, Akai might not be the one who discovered Scotch real affiliation and reported this to the BO, but he might be the one who caused his death.

So my theory negates that Date is Scotch, since it would have to be at least 2 years ago when Scotch is killed.
sherryx

Posts:
20

Re: Discussion Thread - File 889 : Who is Rum & Scotch? And who is Vermouth for Anokata?

Post by sherryx »

Detective Doroshi wrote: I still don't know if my theory is good, but as for Scotch, I was thinking that he/she might be Wataru Date. The fact that Akai-san does not have any Scotch drinks in his cupboard, might be as a sign of respect for a deceased friend (who might have infiltrated the BO)
I agree with the part about Akai not having Scotch in his cupboard for that reason, but how is this fact evidence for Scotch being Date?
Detective Doroshi wrote:But as for Rum, we don't have any real information on him/her. Only that is he is very close to Anokata.
Since Anokata has appeared before and Rum is supposedly very close to him, I wonder if we've also seen Rum before... I thought Rum's introduction was quite abrupt, so if we've seen him/her before this could be a reason why.
Detective Doroshi wrote:About Vermouth, I have got the suspicion that she might be Anokata's mother or any other close relative.The unknown grief she holds against Haibara Ai could it be associated to it? That could be a possibility. But the fact that she protects Shinichi and Haibara as children must probably be associated to the fact that she is close to Anokata.
I also think that she is directly related to Anokata but I feel she is probably younger (no reason why, just an impression). I don't think this is related to Shinichi or Haibara in any way. She protects Shinichi because of that time in New York, and she has never protected Haibara (didn't she actively try to kill her a couple of times?) Imo she doesn't particularly really hate Haibara like Gin does, she just follows all Organisation orders (including killing Haibara on sight) except for when it concerns Shinichi or Ran.
Nemomon
This is my melody and it's just the raver's fantasy

Posts:
1156

Re: Discussion Thread - File 898 : Who is Rum & Scotch? And who is Vermouth for Anokata?

Post by Nemomon »

Vermouth is kind of weird. During the New York case she knew he's the son of her best friend (she admitted that Yukiko is her best friend during the Mystery Train case (at least in anime, perhaps in the manga too)), then why she tried to kill him? Even though back that he didn't have any clue what's going on and who really that murderer is. And now she's going to risk her own life to protect him. I wonder if she has any regrets that she tried to kill him...
My dad’s a soldier blue I’ll be a soldier, too
When I grow older you will see me rescue you
I’ll teach you this old song so you can sing along
When I am dead and gone the day won’t be so long.
User avatar
soul_dreamer

Posts:
918

Re: Discussion Thread - File 898 : Who is Rum & Scotch? And who is Vermouth for Anokata?

Post by soul_dreamer »

Rum: Not much to say about him (I think he's man). We only knows he's close to the boss. Anyway, I will write my thoughts on Rum. They most likely will change, when we get more information.

Rum is close to the boss and more important than Gin, which made me think that Rum is older than Gin. Considering that Rum is close to the boss, he most likely knows who the boss is and maybe even BO's goal. I would say that Rum is 40-70 years old. I'm also interested what his mission is and what division he's in. It would be more interesting, if he would be in division such as software development or even drug development rather than being another assassin. We could find more information through him. It would be very interesting, if he was the character we already met, but if that the case, I would say his one of those characters, who works in some big company and we saw him just few times.

Scotch: He's definitely not Date. I also agree that Akai didn't just simply kill him, because he found out that he's a spy. As it was mentioned before Scotch's death could be actually just accident caused by Akai, who didn't mean to kill Scotch in the first place or either there was no other choice for Akai but kill Scotch. However, Akai definitely regret what happened.

Vermouth: I will say she's related to the boss. She could even boss' mum, adopted child or his wife or being related to him in other way. Most likely we will find out about Vermouth's relation to the boss, where the boss's identity will be revealed to us or just before that.
Nemomon
This is my melody and it's just the raver's fantasy

Posts:
1156

Re: Discussion Thread - File 898 : Who is Rum & Scotch? And who is Vermouth for Anokata?

Post by Nemomon »

Somehow I imagine Rum being someone like Pisco - a guy that owns a company, and finances the BO. Since he's close to the Boss, he must be either rich or important in Japan.

Though there's still a chance that Rum is a quite young lad, also shrunk (that's why (s)he's close to the Boss), and more mad that Chianti and Gin combined.
My dad’s a soldier blue I’ll be a soldier, too
When I grow older you will see me rescue you
I’ll teach you this old song so you can sing along
When I am dead and gone the day won’t be so long.
User avatar
soul_dreamer

Posts:
918

Re: Discussion Thread - File 898 : Who is Rum & Scotch? And who is Vermouth for Anokata?

Post by soul_dreamer »

Pisco also came to my mind, when I thought of Rum and who knows maybe as Vermouth, he doesn't age. I really would like Rum to be very smart even smarter that Conan, so Rum could always be one move before Conan and others. I imagine Rum someone who is very intelligent, composed in every situation and always find right solution and he's more ruthless than Gin, well I hope that his character will be like that or similar, at least. Anyway, I want him to be someone, who will be a hard opponent to defeat, someone, who Conan will have hard times with.
chinpokomon

Posts:
102

Re: Discussion Thread - File 898 : Who is Rum & Scotch? And who is Vermouth for Anokata?

Post by chinpokomon »

aside from the whole rum thing the one thing I didn't got about that chapter is why burbon didn't turn akai to the BO? he knows he's alive so what the hell? by that he's also saving kir so I find it very strange and also why is he still working at that resturant? what reason could he have for staying?
Nemomon
This is my melody and it's just the raver's fantasy

Posts:
1156

Re: Discussion Thread - File 898 : Who is Rum & Scotch? And who is Vermouth for Anokata?

Post by Nemomon »

chinpokomon wrote:aside from the whole rum thing the one thing I didn't got about that chapter is why burbon didn't turn akai to the BO? he knows he's alive so what the hell? by that he's also saving kir so I find it very strange and also why is he still working at that resturant? what reason could he have for staying?
Rei wants to destroy the BO like Akai wants. He knows that he must cooperate with Akai if he wants to succeed. Plus, Akai already gave him the gun, so he may track its sales and know where BO gains their weapons and other equipment (and perhaps block that source).

He stays at the restaurant because he knows that Conan is a major player in this game of chess, and wants to be close to him. Conan said "you're the enemy of the bad guys, right?". Bad guys. Rei must think that Conan knows about the existence of the BO. If so, he think that better will be checking him especially that FBI is all around him, and he was in the hospital back then.
My dad’s a soldier blue I’ll be a soldier, too
When I grow older you will see me rescue you
I’ll teach you this old song so you can sing along
When I am dead and gone the day won’t be so long.
Post Reply