Spoilers! The Future of DC <3

[JohnTitor]

Relax, dude. Making out theories is the best part of reading DC (so far) (at least for me).

[caribou]

D: Gosho, I don't mind if you take more time with each chapter but PLEASE THINK OF BETTER MURDER CASES/TRICKS -.- (and if you can't think of any, it's your own fault for dragging on this long!!! )

No offense meant, but if you are that unsatisfied, why not create something cool/nice/suspense ect. and send him your manuscript?

I suppose over 500 cases + hundreds of names/surnames are close to brain-cracking.

As for me, what he's done is definitely appreciated. Forgive me if I say anything stupid/with mistake.

of course I also appreciate all the work that he's done. I'm merely saying that I wouldn't mind him taking more time to write and draw his cases, if it means that we get better and more interesting stories. Since Conan is supposed to be a detective manga, then it's kind of a pity if he is no longer focusing on the murder tricks and stories...

I personally hope that even if Conan correctly deduces the right murderer, Sera should be the one saving the day!

[psyko_stevey_999]

Don't you even go there, the last thing we need is for that man to take ANY longer to get to the end of this show than he already is. Quality is obviously something to strive for on a chapter to chapter basis but...i mean come on you can't honestly want him to take longer

[sonoci]

I have to agree with caribou here. Quality is better than Quantity IMO

Besides, think about it. Quality attracts bigger audiences (or at least it should *cough*HiddenGems*cough*) so if there was more quality in cases there'd be a bigger audience for Gosho and probably more profit that way. At least if we had really high quality cases the wait wouldn't be as long and dragged out since we'd be enjoying it. Not to mention, Gosho has the ending written out somewhere and likely ready to be drawn already in case something should happen to him. Gosho's the one deciding to take as long as he is to finish.

I'm betting there are a lot of people that are frustrated by the wait at this point, but so far no one's been annoyed enough to go end Gosho's life (which would be a horrible thing to do just for an ending of a manga, awesome as DC is). Personally I think part of being a fan for DC (or any fiction, really) involves accepting the mangaka's choices: whether it be ShinRan forever, a lack of suicides, or the amount of time it takes for the plot to be told. I think JD- said it best: "The man has a story to tell and he's going to tell it at whatever pace he chooses."

[psyko_stevey_999]

Sure let him tell it at the pace he chooses, that doesn't mean we should encourage him to SLOW DOWN!

[sonoci]

Relax, it's not like Gosho reads these posts Even if he did, he probably wouldn't take the fans' words too seriously.

[kkslider5552000]

Besides, think about it. Quality attracts bigger audiences (or at least it should *cough*HiddenGems*cough*) so if there was more quality in cases there'd be a bigger audience for Gosho and probably more profit that way.

hahahahahahahahahahahaha

oh wait you were serious?

I'd again like to point out that crappy AOs have better ratings than Clash of Red and Black did. Nuff said.

The problem isn't the slow pace, it's that after the Red Shirt case he decided LOL CAN'T HAVE THE BAD GUYS APPEAR FOR 2 YEARS LOL because Gosho, as awesome as he is, too often uses the "if it ain't broke" cliche or just decided for no reason to not even attempt to make most of the cases even the tiniest of importance to any plot. This is despite the fact that completely abandoning plot or character development after increasing the amount of plot or character development already, especially in a series that is clearly going towards a definitive ending, is pretty much always a horrible idea. It almost doesn't matter if there's a great case if there was no point to it.

[caribou]

Well, between:

(a) 4 rather crappy filler cases over a period of 12 weeks, to get from plot point A to point B,

-OR-

(b) 2 GOOD filler cases over a period of 12 weeks, to get from plot point A to plot point B,

...I'll take option (b).

cos like what kkslider said, Gosho doesn't seem to be heading towards an important plot development in most of the recent cases, and if they are just going to be fillers then I don't mind if there are less of them but with better quality stories!!!

[Wakarimashita]

Why talk about "filler cases" (which is obviously pejorative) when the cases are what this manga is all about (or at least it's first purpose) ? The BO is basically bonus and if people are expecting manga with faster paced plots : 1) they shouldn't read long-running Shônen 2) especially not DC.

As far as cases which don't involve the plot are concerned, the only complaint I have is the absence of Christie-like cases where they are stranded somewhere in the recent years. Otherwise, most of the cases are good or at least decent. Sure, there are some cases I don't like because I'm not a fan of the characters involved or because I find them weak but some fans will never be happy with the everyday cases because all they want is BO and plot. That's not a problem, however these fans shouldn't expect everyone to have the same point of view about DC. Personally, I don't mind if the the manga keeps running for a certain amount of years and I couldn't care less about what happens with the plot seeing as it is not why I read DC. So yes, there are sane people who wouldn't mind him taking longer. And given DC's sales in Japan, apparently lots of people still enjoy the everyday cases.

[kkslider5552000]

The BO is basically bonus and if people are expecting manga with faster paced plots : 1) they shouldn't read long-running Shônen 2) especially not DC.

The problem is for a while (and I will admit, I don't read the manga, this is just what I've heard about, and no one's said I'm actually wrong about it) it hasn't gone at even a slow pace. If the pace was a temperature it would pretty much be absolute zero.

And honestly, looking at stuff I have seen recently like Kirin's Horn, Eri's birthday, Tori Man etc. Those are some of Gosho's worst stuff in this series. And they happened all around the same time. If they had a point in any way to ANYTHING that happens after the case is over, I wouldn't dislike those cases nearly as much. Or maybe just have a more clever story for the case. During the Vermouth arc, even the cases that didn't involve plot characters often had a really good and clever story to them (the 3Ks being a great example). I do agree stranded cases would help but my point is some of the lesser cases should have a point. The Bank Robbery case was pretty silly but since Akai returned it was awesome.

also caribou's idea is awful by default because that would mean more AOs. We haven't gotten any horrible AOs lately but let's not push our luck. :p

[Wakarimashita]

The BO is basically bonus and if people are expecting manga with faster paced plots : 1) they shouldn't read long-running Shônen 2) especially not DC.

The problem is for a while (and I will admit, I don't read the manga, this is just what I've heard about, and no one's said I'm actually wrong about it) it hasn't gone at even a slow pace. If the pace was a temperature it would pretty much be absolute zero.

And honestly, looking at stuff I have seen recently like Kirin's Horn, Eri's birthday, Tori Man etc. Those are some of Gosho's worst stuff in this series. And they happened all around the same time. If they had a point in any way to ANYTHING that happens after the case is over, I wouldn't dislike those cases nearly as much. Or maybe just have a more clever story for the case. During the Vermouth arc, even the cases that didn't involve plot characters often had a really good and clever story to them (the 3Ks being a great example). I do agree stranded cases would help but my point is some of the lesser cases should have a point. The Bank Robbery case was pretty silly but since Akai returned it was awesome.

also caribou's idea is awful by default because that would mean more AOs. We haven't gotten any horrible AOs lately but let's not push our luck. :p

DC's pacing has almost always been extremely slow in terms of plot. People don't seem to remember how long it even took for this manga/anime to actually go somewhere. The only exception which was both well-paced and interesting was the Vermouth Arc (Vol 24-42) and I have my theory about that. Otherwise, we've had about 80 episodes with nothing in terms of plot but a cell-phone (talk about bad and useless plot progression), and nearly 100 episodes after that just for the Kir-Eisuke stuff (actually plot progression at that time wasn't too bad, it just felt long because of Eisuke's character IMO and because it wasn't very interesting until the clash of red and black came up).

Like you're basically saying, what made the Vermouth Arc the best among all of the arcs we had in my taste was the fact that a lot of cases  (which were all pretty good at the time) involved at least a short discussion about something linked to the plot satisfying everyone (ex : Mouri's files being stolen, looking for info about Vermouth on the internet, the case with Numabuchi, the case with James Black...). The thing is, at that time, we had a lot of new interesting mysterious characters (not like Eisuke) which helped the pacing of the arc. Compare that to the Bourbon Arc where the only equivalent are Okiya (which might not even be a real new character) and Bourbon (Scar Akai ?) who barely appear at all.

[SZ5531]

YAY! I read the latest chapter

Spoiler:

Good thing that Ran and Sera take down the criminal with Shinichi's expert lying skills XD Also, Conan is not showing any hostility to Sera at the end of the chapter... Strange.

[sonoci]

what made the Vermouth Arc the best among all of the arcs we had in my taste was the fact that a lot of cases  (which were all pretty good at the time) involved at least a short discussion about something linked to the plot satisfying everyone (ex : Mouri's files being stolen, looking for info about Vermouth on the internet, the case with Numabuchi, the case with James Black...). The thing is, at that time, we had a lot of new interesting mysterious characters (not like Eisuke) which helped the pacing of the arc. Compare that to the Bourbon Arc where the only equivalent are Okiya (which might not even be a real new character) and Bourbon (Scar Akai ?) who barely appear at all.

^This

Along with the quality of the cases in that period of time, the fact that there were the little discussions and hints gave the impression that the plot was still around and the BO were still doing things behind the scenes. Right now (and any portion really that doesn't have the little reminders) is a bit too reminiscent of the old preHaibara days where there was a wonder if the BO actually meant more than just 'kicking off the series'. Really, until Haibara showed up, I thought Gin and Vodka were one time appearances. Luckily that wasn't the case.

At the very least right now Okiya could show up a bit more. I mean, even with Eisuke, odd/not good/meh a character he was, at least he had some sort of presence. Okiya is almost equivalent to a house decoration at this point: he's just there to...well, be there. In fact, Haibara's 'sense' of him is probably just some sort of weird deja vu of a poster that hung around the BO bases. That's probably it >3>

[Shuusgirl]

YAY! I read the latest chapter

Spoiler:

Good thing that Ran and Sera take down the criminal with Shinichi's expert lying skills XD Also, Conan is not showing any hostility to Sera at the end of the chapter... Strange.

Spoiler:

Yeah, I don't think he gets what she's saying.

[KnightusMaximus]

what made the Vermouth Arc the best among all of the arcs we had in my taste was the fact that a lot of cases  (which were all pretty good at the time) involved at least a short discussion about something linked to the plot satisfying everyone (ex : Mouri's files being stolen, looking for info about Vermouth on the internet, the case with Numabuchi, the case with James Black...). The thing is, at that time, we had a lot of new interesting mysterious characters (not like Eisuke) which helped the pacing of the arc. Compare that to the Bourbon Arc where the only equivalent are Okiya (which might not even be a real new character) and Bourbon (Scar Akai ?) who barely appear at all.

^This

Along with the quality of the cases in that period of time, the fact that there were the little discussions and hints gave the impression that the plot was still around and the BO were still doing things behind the scenes. Right now (and any portion really that doesn't have the little reminders) is a bit too reminiscent of the old preHaibara days where there was a wonder if the BO actually meant more than just 'kicking off the series'. Really, until Haibara showed up, I thought Gin and Vodka were one time appearances. Luckily that wasn't the case.

At the very least right now Okiya could show up a bit more. I mean, even with Eisuke, odd/not good/meh a character he was, at least he had some sort of presence. Okiya is almost equivalent to a house decoration at this point: he's just there to...well, be there. In fact, Haibara's 'sense' of him is probably just some sort of weird deja vu of a poster that hung around the BO bases. That's probably it >3>

Yeah, even after Volume 42, "Black Organization/Drug-related" plot development still happened generally with regularity... usually some sort of core plot development happens in each volume, really. It wasn't until the file 700s that that element of the plot really grinded to a halt. The bad guys generally never appeared very often (ever), but they showed up quite a bit during the Rena/Eisuke arc (files 499-504, 553-555, and then 595-609. Their appearances were separated by less than 50 files. Unfortunately nowadays it seems like it's gone back to 100.)

VOL 43: 1-2 (Haibara declines FBI Witness Protection program)
VOL 44: 11 (Dr. Araide returns to school, chats with Conan about recent events)
VOL 45: 6-11 (Cell phone arc kicks off)
VOL 46: 1-11 (Cell phone arc continues without interruption. Plot hints in *each* case, ends with 46-11)
VOL 47: 1-4 (This is actually a Ran's suspicions case, not an Org plot case, but I'll count it anyway.)
VOL 48: 9-10 (Beginning of Rena arc)
VOL 49: 1-10 (Entire volume of Org plot developments, Eisuke introduced.)
VOL 50: No particular Org plot developments, but Haibara does remind Conan that the BO will notice if he acts too much like a detective.
VOL 51: 9-11 (Eisuke trails Conan and watches him investigate; Conan notices and adjusts deduction.)
VOL 52: Nothing really.
VOL 53: 7-10: Shadows of the Black Org. BO appears. Major info revealed...
VOL 54: 1-6: More plot hints.
VOL 55: A very interesting flashback story but nothing that is clearly Org related.
VOL 56: Here the plot picked up again. 56-7 to 56-11 is all Eisuke/Hondou investigation.
VOL 57: 1-5 is more Eisuke investigation. 9-11 is the beginning of the Clash arc.
VOL 58: 1-11, an entire volume of uninterrupted Black Org files. Practically unprecedented.
VOL 59: 1 (Akai shot), 11 (Eisuke's last appearance case)
VOL 60: 1-2 (Eisuke leaves for America, discovers Shinichi's identity), 3-5 (Beginning of Bourbon arc. Okiya introduced).
VOL 61: 5-7 (Okiya hints), 8-10 (Sonoko and Ran meet Okiya; Okiya drinks Bourbon)
VOL 62: 5-11 (Shinichi returns, infamous Shiragami case.)
VOL 63: 1-2 (End of Shinichi returns #2 arc)
VOL 64: 1-3 (More Okiya hints)
VOL 65: 3-5 (Jodie reminisces, sees Scar Akai.), 6-7 ("Fake" Org case)
VOL 66: Nothing really except the charm discussion.
VOL 67: 3-8 (Latest BO case)

Then...
VOL 68: Nothing.
VOL 69: Nothing.
VOL 70: Nothing.

Since volume 71, though, we've had the London arc, a pretty pointless Okiya appearance and now Sera's introduction. London and Sera are major "core" plot developments, so I'll take that as a sign that we're hopefully returning back to an earlier style of plot development.

Of course I personally feel, like everyone else, that Volumes 24 through 42 were superior, more interesting and less predictable; but that's a different argument from pacing, and the pacing wasn't really that bad until the Bourbon arc, and the 700 files in particular.~