Forum reserved for discussing specific points of the story—mostly from the manga. Be warned, these discussions will be current with the manga and will spoil many plot lines for anime-centric fans.
DCreader wrote:
Ran told Shinichi that she picked up one of the many scattered pens around the Gherkin.
The mysterious woman shouldn't be Mrs Glass because she's 'supposed' to be blind.
Thanks for clarifying the Gherkin thing! I still think that Mrs. Glass is a highly likely suspect for the mysterious woman. It explains the sunglasses - blind people often wear them because they don't always look where they are supposed to when talking to someone and it bothers people. Mrs. Glass is confirmed blind.
Spoiler: 744
Gosho gives almost all older women (30+) lipstick as a way of helping readers distinguish their age. It's a drawing habit of his. Also, Mrs. Glass is a serious Sherlock Fan, so she would pay attention to what Ran screams at Shinichi: "If you're a detective, then at the very least you should deduce what is in my heart!"
Last edited by Chekhov MacGuffin on September 12th, 2010, 7:23 am, edited 1 time in total.
I still haven't settled on one person yet for the mystery woman, although Mrs. Glass does seem the most likely candidate. The only reason why I am hesitant to think it's her is because it looked like the woman was turning her head to look at who was arguing, and I don't think Mrs Glass, being blind, would do that. Not sure though, maybe she would, or maybe the woman was just turning her head a bit, but that is my only doubt about it being Mrs. Glass. As for Yukiko, I don't think it's her. I think Yukiko would have been following Conan the whole time if she was disguised and all, so if it was her I think that she would have been watching and listening the whole time, or if she had just found them she would have tuned in on the conversation earlier. I don't think it's Shiho or Elena either...
Hmmm... I like Chekhov's theory, but wouldn't it be too simple...?
Spoiler:
I mean, in that way, we will get "ATHENA" again (or TA##NA, okay), but I'm asking again, why the murderer would make so much effort to kill ONE person. I know, he actually said that "Murdered, a person will be", so Minerva is a possible victim, but that riddle is...omg...so hard... Wouldn't it be easier to just kill her? Or maybe the murderer has some connections with Glass family?? Or Hades Sabara?? Besides the riddle has seven lines, so it must be seven letters, not six. Or maybe, the last line has a different information...
About the swords. Probably I'm wrong, but maybe it's about flag of the City of London?
The fact that this chap is called Hades is a pretty strong hint all these "gods" are connected with each other. Note how he's named after a Greek God.
The coat of arms of Croydon features two swords on a white background
They'r not the most prominent feature though; and Croydon isn't a very precise statement of place.
We don't make mistakes. We have happy accidents.
Remember: A thin paint will stick to a thick paint.
I was thinking of the two swords on a white background as well, but i also realized that two swords sounds like Tussauds. Madame Tussauds is a famous Wax Museum in London. Tussauds is literally pronounced as 'two swords'. When i googled 'two swords london', interestingly, Madame Tussauds came up as the results.
So, Hestia is the mother of Hades, in mythology. Would that be a picture of the old lady when she was young? Or is it someone else? We don't know if the old lady is actually Hades' mother. Also, Hestia is Athena's and Apollo's Aunt. It's too obvious of a hint, in my opinion, but if Aoyama took the effort of naming all of them after greek and roman gods, maybe it's for that reason.
I was thinking of the two swords on a white background as well, but i also realized that two swords sounds like Tussauds. Madame Tussauds is a famous Wax Museum in London. Tussauds is literally pronounced as 'two swords'. When i googled 'two swords london', interestingly, Madame Tussauds came up as the results.
that's a very smart find! if two swords piercing a white back = tussauds piercing a white back, maybe it's referring to Tussaud's process of cutting and sculpting the wax? what's more, wikipedia says that Madam Tussauds used to be located on Baker Street itself... not a coincidence, i think. but i don't really know how this helps with the riddle solving.
"Shh! Celebrate after the curtain of this bloody stage closes."
Dus wrote:
Chekhov, you keep omitting the two swords. The riddle seems to indicate that the word ends with that letter
I don't really know what to make of it. I don't think I have the riddle right yet. I am not dead set on "Athena" being the answer.
Initially, I interpreted the last line as a time hint more than a place location. There is the theory brought up much earlier (pg 25 or so) that the two swords represented the hands of a clock and thus a time. If you are stabbing someone with two swords at the same time, I suppose it would suggest the hands should line up with one another, but I'm not sure that is what is being implied.
If it's two physical swords, the king of spades has a pair of them. There is also this quote by Misztina
Misztina wrote: maybe we get more clues from this file, unil then one thing has caught my attention, that is the "piercing a white back with two swords" part. There is a Tarot card named "Two of swords" and it has a blindfolded lady in white on it. To support this idea, an internet article says: "the suit of swords deals with logic and the use of the intellect" and so on. I thought this might be interesting.
Last edited by Chekhov MacGuffin on September 12th, 2010, 7:22 am, edited 1 time in total.
Chekhov, you keep omitting the two swords. The riddle seems to indicate that the word ends with that letteer
I don't really know what to make of it. I don't think I have the riddle right yet. I am not dead set on "Athena" being the answer.
Initially, I interpreted the last line as a time hint more than a place location. There is the theory brought up much earlier (pg 25 or so) that the two swords represented the hands of a clock and thus a time. If you are stabbing someone with two swords at the same time, I suppose it would suggest the hands should line up with one another, but I'm not sure that is what is being implied.
If it's two physical swords, the king of spades has a pair of them. There is also this quote by Misztina
Misztina wrote: maybe we get more clues from this file, unil then one thing has caught my attention, that is the "piercing a white back with two swords" part. There is a Tarot card named "Two of swords" and it has a blindfolded lady in white on it. To support this idea, an internet article says: "the suit of swords deals with logic and the use of the intellect" and so on. I thought this might be interesting.
I agree with you. The riddle would be useless if it contains only information about a place where the murder was planned or only about person who will be killed... Conan and others know that the murder will be SOON, but when? There must be some information about it.
Or maybe the time of murder is somehow coded in the riddle. First sentence is "A rolling bell rises me", so it must be in the morning, right? Then "It rings again for my hatred". Somewhere I read that Big Ben rings every 15 minutes, so this theory is weak, but who knows? Maybe there's some connection with different types of chimes.
Here's some information from Wikipedia:
Chimes
Along with the Great Bell, the belfry houses four quarter bells which play the Westminster Quarters on the quarter hours. The four quarter bells are G♯, F♯, E, and B. They were cast by John Warner & Sons at their Crescent Foundry in 1857 (G♯, F♯ and B) and 1858 (E). The Foundry was in Jewin Crescent, in what is now known as The Barbican, in the City of London.
The Quarter Bells play a 20-chime sequence, 1–4 at quarter past, 5–12 at half past, 13–20 and 1–4 at quarter to, and 5–20 on the hour (which sounds 25 seconds before the main bell tolls the hour). Because the low bell (B) is struck twice in quick succession, there is not enough time to pull a hammer back, and it is supplied with two wrench hammers on opposite sides of the bell. The tune is that of the Cambridge Chimes, first used for the chimes of Great St Mary's church, Cambridge, and supposedly a variation, attributed to William Crotch, on a phrase from Handel's Messiah. The notional words of the chime, again derived from Great St Mary's and in turn an allusion to Psalm 37:23-24, are: "All through this hour/Lord be my guide/And by Thy power/No foot shall slide". They are written on a plaque on the wall of the clock room.
Last edited by RedPoppy on August 31st, 2010, 2:34 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Well, I'm not sure what the make of the final line either. "The finish everything" seems to tie it in with the "pickle" and "onion" line but it's also written as a command from someone else while the other lines seem to be his own thoughts...
We don't make mistakes. We have happy accidents.
Remember: A thin paint will stick to a thick paint.
Conan took an antidote in File 745 is after 8 pm, File 746 could be tomorrow morning to afternoon, since the duration of the antidote is 24 hours, then Shinichi will change back to Conan at about 8 pm. However Shinichi took an antidote earlier, the duration will probably last less than 24 hours. Back to Shiragami case, Conan took second pill right after shrinking, the duration can only last about 4 hours. The time returning to Japan is File 746 tomorrow night, no doubt about that Shinichi will change back to Conan before setting home.
Meaning he'll have to stay back with the professor, even if he gets a new antidote in time. He'll have to wait a couple of days before he can take a pill and it lasts long enough for him to board the plane.
We don't make mistakes. We have happy accidents.
Remember: A thin paint will stick to a thick paint.
