Forum reserved for discussing specific points of the story—mostly from the manga. Be warned, these discussions will be current with the manga and will spoil many plot lines for anime-centric fans.
mihai wrote:@Yottas: agree about the shower head, Conan or the detectives will find paint under the blood(probably) and confirm how and when Waka was killed. That way Rumi would be suspicious since she was already there and where the murder weapon was, but it's kinda difficult to kill Waka when Ran already fainted on top of her. Also, if Waka was killed after Ran fainted, the 2 guys are not suspects because Conan was with them.
That's why the thing about the coins is important...
Spoiler:
I think the coin(s) could be used to either fake to open the door or to fake the door was closed.
Yottas
Spoiler:
The thing with the coins is to show that the boyfriend isn't wearing his contact lenses. The other guy drops the coins into Conan's hand, while the boyfriend holds his palm out for Conan to pick up the coins himself because the boyfriend couldn't see Conan's hand very well.
Rumi is likely collaborating with the murderer or she's the murderer herself and Mitsuaki is covering for her.
Spoiler:
Kenya is the most likely culprit because he had the key and it looks like he's not wearing his contact lenses so the chloroform won't dry out and damage his eyes.
It looks like Rumi isn't wearing her lenses either because she dropped the key earlier in the case if one of them could see properly then the the key wouldn't have been dropped.
Spoiler:
In the final panel of file 857 page 4 it looks like Mitsuaki eyes are hurting, everyone else recovering from the chloroform held their heads so it looks like Mitsuaki is the least likely culprit.
Rumi is likely collaborating with the murderer or she's the murderer herself and Mitsuaki is covering for her.
Spoiler:
Kenya is the most likely culprit because he had the key and it looks like he's not wearing his contact lenses so the chloroform won't dry out and damage his eyes.
It looks like Rumi isn't wearing her lenses either because she dropped the key earlier in the case if one of them could see properly then the the key wouldn't have been dropped.
Spoiler:
In the final panel of file 857 page 4 it looks like Mitsuaki eyes are hurting, everyone else recovering from the chloroform held their heads so it looks like Mitsuaki is the least likely culprit.
Spoiler:
Rumi is probably wearing her contacts, when she drops the key it's because Kenya drops it into her hand but misses because he can't see it. That's why when he gives Conan the coins later he holds his hand out instead of dropping them, since he doesn't want to miss his hand again. I wonder if it's possible that Kenya gave Waka his contacts, and she was putting them in or taking them out when she was killed? That would explain why she was winking. And the body was probably dressed to look like she was getting in the shower, since she still has mascara on.
However, I also think that Rumi is suspicious, since she's the only one who could benefit from the chloroform... I'm not sure how it would help either of the guys, but if Waka wasn't actually dead when Ran got there somehow it would mask the time of death.
One thing I just noticed on file 857 page 8: "The only one who wasn't surprised when she saw this apartment was a first-year girl who joined our circle this year... her father... it seems he's the president of that company's corporate group..." Is Sonoko or her sister involved with them too?
Hi everyone, I'm new here! I hope we get along well, and forgive my bad English
Spoiler:
I've just read both files and I've just noticed that Waka-san is also winking in the picture Conan took and showed to Rumi. It is also possible, but unlikely, that she met her killer and winked him/her?
Another theory is that Waka might have been putting on her contacts when she happened to be killed; hence the reason why she had an eye closed. And another thing: the mascara that's trickling out of the open eye. Maybe Waka was crying for some reason, and the mascara run? But again, a tear dropping just from one eye might indicate that her eyes were a bit itchy so that she had to scratch them a bit. Due to chloroform
Now, we assume Kenya goes to Waka's house while she is sleeping to look for his watch and finds her on the bathroom floor because she fainted due to the chloroform Rumi had spread before. He also realizes that there's some red paint (intended to be blood) and thinks she's death but doesn't know who the killer is, so he decides to run away in order not to become a suspect. His eyes are a bit itchy so he takes off his contacts, and therefore, drops the spare key afterwards.
So, Rumi planned to use Sera at the very beggining as an "alivi", but uses Ran instead. They go to Waka's place, but Kenya calls Rumi to make her look for his watch, thing that puts off a bit her original plans. So, after she finishes talking to Kenya, she goes to the bathroom with the club golf and, while Waka's waking up with a headache and scratching her eye closed (just like Ran does afterwads) she beats her to death. Hence the reason why Waka has an eye open. Obviously, nobody would strongly suspect Rumi being the murderess given she was with Sera all the time the two guys were missing, if we consider Waka was killed at the same time the chloroform was spread.
Or it could be that the one who dropped the key was Rumi indeed because she was still feeling dizzy, and after Kenya had realized about that fact he removed his contacts in order to protect Rumi.
Let's see what happens in the end, and again, sorry for my English
Hi everyone, I'm new here! I hope we get along well, and forgive my bad English
Spoiler:
I've just read both files and I've just noticed that Waka-san is also winking in the picture Conan took and showed to Rumi. It is also possible, but unlikely, that she met her killer and winked him/her?
Another theory is that Waka might have been putting on her contacts when she happened to be killed; hence the reason why she had an eye closed. And another thing: the mascara that's trickling out of the open eye. Maybe Waka was crying for some reason, and the mascara run? But again, a tear dropping just from one eye might indicate that her eyes were a bit itchy so that she had to scratch them a bit. Due to chloroform
Now, we assume Kenya goes to Waka's house while she is sleeping to look for his watch and finds her on the bathroom floor because she fainted due to the chloroform Rumi had spread before. He also realizes that there's some red paint (intended to be blood) and thinks she's death but doesn't know who the killer is, so he decides to run away in order not to become a suspect. His eyes are a bit itchy so he takes off his contacts, and therefore, drops the spare key afterwards.
So, Rumi planned to use Sera at the very beggining as an "alivi", but uses Ran instead. They go to Waka's place, but Kenya calls Rumi to make her look for his watch, thing that puts off a bit her original plans. So, after she finishes talking to Kenya, she goes to the bathroom with the club golf and, while Waka's waking up with a headache and scratching her eye closed (just like Ran does afterwads) she beats her to death. Hence the reason why Waka has an eye open. Obviously, nobody would strongly suspect Rumi being the murderess given she was with Sera all the time the two guys were missing, if we consider Waka was killed at the same time the chloroform was spread.
Or it could be that the one who dropped the key was Rumi indeed because she was still feeling dizzy, and after Kenya had realized about that fact he removed his contacts in order to protect Rumi.
Let's see what happens in the end, and again, sorry for my English
I wonder if it's possible that Kenya gave Waka his contacts, and she was putting them in or taking them out when she was killed? That would explain why she was winking. And the body was probably dressed to look like she was getting in the shower, since she still has mascara on.
This is what I thought as well! Most plausible explanation for only one eye being open. Although as a wearer of contact lenses myself, I can say that I always put them in and out with both eyes open, haha.
I'm still kinda disappointed Ran fainting was pretty... irrelevant so far. That there was chloroforme involved was made pretty clear without that. Only explanation is that it was benefitting the culprit somehow. Since Kenya explicitly asked Ran to accompany Rumi even though that was highly untypical of him, he's the top candidate I'd say. Just not sure why someone had to see Waka and then faint (be it Ran, or, as originally planned only Rumi). Was it in any way confusing the time of death?
Look like the innocent flower,
But be the serpent under it.
("Macbeth")
mihai wrote:Sonoko's classmate is Rumi's sister so I don't really think she hanged out with Rumi or her friends. It could be someone else
I was thinking Sonoko's sister, since she's older and I can't think of any other characters in the manga who have parents that are the head of a financial group... Seems like it would be odd to talk about it mysteriously like that if it's not referencing a character.
A series resolution last page side note will simply say "Next Issue, A New Series", but File 858 last page side note said "A Must-Read New Series", so it means new series will have great storyline as the notes like "Must-Read", "Don't Miss It" are rare to see, someone could wonder "why it is must-read, not reading will cost you anything, huh?". The following is last page side note proved the last page side note doesn't mean good-for-nothing:
File 699: Detective Boys mentioned Akai, last page side note said "Don't Miss It", however next file is File 700, it's not surprise to have BO story http://www.dctp.ws/V67-Reader/V67-3Read/A16.html
File 795: After Tooru Amuro's debut, last page side note said "A Jolting New Series!!", the new series is Detective Nocture, since it is about to reach File 800, it's not surprise to have BO story http://www.dctp.ws/V75-Reader/V75-11Read/A16.html
File 797: Amuro and Sera appeared in this series, last page side note said "Next Issue Is A Must-Read", who expected Haibara and Okiya appeared too, it begins Bourbon - 3 Choose 1 and Haibara begins to trust Okiya http://www.dctp.ws/V76-Reader/V76-2Read/A16.html
File 813: Okiya discovered Conan's true identify, last page side note said "Missing Next Issue Is Strictly Prohibited", but it just increase the plot of Sera http://www.dctp.ws/V77-Reader/V77-7Read/A16.html
File 814: last page side note said "Head Toward The Heart Of The Matter", new series is Shiho returned since 13 years, then Mystery Train's BO case, it leads to reveal Bourbon's identify, Okiya opened his eye which is identical to Akai http://www.dctp.ws/V77-Reader/V77-8Read/A16.html
Those are all related Akai/Okiya, then Okiya will appear in a new series.
Last edited by Conan 48:69 on May 12th, 2013, 10:50 pm, edited 1 time in total.
A series resolution last page side note will simply say "Next Issue, A New Series", but File 858 last page side note said "A Must-Read Next Issue", so it means new series will have great storyline as "Must-See", "Don't Miss It" is rare to see, someone could wonder "why it is must-read, not reading will cost you anything, huh?". The following is last page side note proved the last page side note doesn't mean good-for-nothing:
File 699: Detective Boys mentioned Akai, last page side note said "Don't Miss It", however next file is File 700, it's not surprise to have BO story http://www.dctp.ws/V67-Reader/V67-3Read/A16.html
File 795: After Tooru Amuro's debut, last page side note said "A Jolting New Series!!", the new series is Detective Nocture, since it is about to reach File 800, it's not surprise to have BO story http://www.dctp.ws/V75-Reader/V75-11Read/A16.html
File 797: Amuro and Sera appeared in this series, last page side note said "Next Issue Is A Must-Read", who expected Haibara and Okiya appeared too, it begins Bourbon - 3 Choose 1 and Haibara begins to trust Okiya http://www.dctp.ws/V76-Reader/V76-2Read/A16.html
File 813: Okiya discovered Conan's true identify, last page side note said "Missing Next Issue Is Strictly Prohibited", but it just increase the plot of Sera http://www.dctp.ws/V77-Reader/V77-7Read/A16.html
File 814: last page side note said "Head Toward The Heart Of The Matter", new series is Shiho returned since 13 years, then Mystery Train's BO case, it leads to reveal Bourbon's identify, Okiya opened his eye which is identical to Akai http://www.dctp.ws/V77-Reader/V77-8Read/A16.html
Those are all related Akai/Okiya, then Okiya will appear in a new series.
nice finding all those last pages
Spoiler:
and it seems you are right. Eri confirms it on chapter 858 that Sera was indeed talking to her brother, but I don't see why she had to give a wrong deduction. Shinichi had to give the right deduction through the phone again so maybe that was he point but didn't both Sera and Okiya figured out that Conan is Shinichi(Okiya clearly did during "Kudou Yusaku's cold case" but I don't know if Sera knew for sure).
edit: about Sonoko's sister, I totally forgot she even had one or how she looked like. Looking at some really old chapters(around ch. 40) I saw she is 24 years old, making her 2-3 years older than guys in this case not likely to know them
Wonder if Subaru/Akai already told Sera the truth...
Spoiler:
if you checked the cbox these days you can see that Eri already saw Sera before the current case and she heard her say the word -nii after the person's name. So Eri think Sera was talking to her older brother and we all well know she calls him Shu-nii.
But if she checked her deduction with him, why was it wrong after all? If it was on purpose, then it's just like the first time she and Conan were investigating a case. I'm curious what is the reason for that.
Wonder if Subaru/Akai already told Sera the truth...
Spoiler:
if you checked the cbox these days you can see that Eri already saw Sera before the current case and she heard her say the word -nii after the person's name. So Eri think Sera was talking to her older brother and we all well know she calls him Shu-nii.
But if she checked her deduction with him, why was it wrong after all? If it was on purpose, then it's just like the first time she and Conan were investigating a case. I'm curious what is the reason for that.
Spoiler:
I do wish it's Subaru/Akai, but he is not the one who revealed his true identify carelessly to anybody without any reason. What if it's Bourbon/Vermouth disguised as Akai to trick Sera again, if it's Bourbon, he gives Sera a wrong deduction to lure Conan solving a case.
This whole chapter gave me the chills.
Sera doesn't seems like someone to be fooled by the BO even thought it would be easy to accomplish that. What worries me the most is the phone-call. If that was indeed Shu-nii we may get one of the biggest confrontations ever. BO vs Shinichi vs Shu/Subaru?
The deduction over the phone, that Sera got, was way to weak and therefore I classify it as a plot to get Shinichi into the open. We already know that some BO members are looking deeper into the whole mess. I just hope we don't get new characters too soon because that would make the whole thing even more complex. It's already at the point where there are too many people involved in this… it may as well be that there is some greater power at work.
The next case has to be awesome with that anouncement from this one
