Discussion Thread: Detective Conan 1,070-1072

[HatiMMOS]

...Rumi being a former BO member (or former government agent/NOC) still has the problem of how she is able to have an APTX list that is updated enough to include Shinichi and to know that Shiho has betrayed the Organization, as well as why she isn't being observed and/or attacked by the BO in spite of having caught Rum's attention.

It was clear to me when Pisco looked up Sherry's name on his laptop and when the Bo used the nightbaron virus, that the Bo uses digital databases. Hacking it or using "social engineering" on a member is a way from others that Wakasa can use to get her hands on precious and important data. She is not necessarly a NoC, she just knew the existence of the Bo while serving Amanda and never made contact with them until the incident took place 17 years ago. We don't know for sure if Rum saw her there or not.
I will actually be pissed off at Gosho if Asaka turns out to be Wakasa. It's way too obvious. Something like "Asaka's sister" will be enough for me.

And I'm not saying that your point can't be true, yours is as likely as mine.

[DCUniverseAficionado]

...Rumi being a former BO member (or former government agent/NOC) still has the problem of how she is able to have an APTX list that is updated enough to include Shinichi and to know that Shiho has betrayed the Organization, as well as why she isn't being observed and/or attacked by the BO in spite of having caught Rum's attention.

It was clear to me when Pisco looked up Sherry's name on his laptop and when the Bo used the nightbaron virus, that the Bo uses digital databases. Hacking it or using "social engineering" on a member is a way from others that Wakasa can use to get her hands on precious and important data. She is not necessarly a NoC, she just knew the existence of the Bo while serving Amanda and never made contact with them until the incident took place 17 years ago. We don't know for sure if Rum saw her there or not.
I will actually be pissed off at Gosho if Asaka turns out to be Wakasa. It's way too obvious. Something like "Asaka's sister" will be enough for me.

So you're saying she didn't need a BO member to give the list to her, because she just hacked the BO and got the info all by herself?
My problem with that is if she pulled that off by herself, there's nothing stopping the government agencies from hacking the BO themselves with legions of hackers, and uncovering every piece of digital info the BO has. Basically, the government agencies can get a huge victory by just hacking the BO.
Even Shūichi/Subaru is clearly capable of hacking (see Mystery Train), so why hasn't he just hacked in and taken all the BO's info?

Kanenori Wakita turned out to be Rum, so odds are Gosho isn't going for the surprise factor, here—he's likely going for the reveal you see coming. Reveals you're meant to see coming (that are meant to be obvious), and reveals that are meant to be surprising (that are not meant to be obvious)—neither one is good or bad on its own, after all... either one can be satisfying or disappointing.

And I'm not saying that your point can't be true, yours is as likely as mine.

No worries, I didn't take it that way.

If Gosho does make Rumi a true third party, then I look forward to seeing how Gosho does it.

[HatiMMOS]

So you're saying she didn't need a BO member to give the list to her, because she just hacked the BO and got the info all by herself?
My problem with that is if she pulled that off by herself, there's nothing stopping the government agencies from hacking the BO themselves with legions of hackers, and uncovering every piece of digital info the BO has. Basically, the government agencies can get a huge victory by just hacking the BO.
Even Shūichi/Subaru is clearly capable of hacking (see Mystery Train), so why hasn't he just hacked in and taken all the BO's info?

Gosho made some characters and gave them incredible talents. Akai is the best at sniping, Makoto is the strongest, Kobayashi is the cutest and Yusaku is the smartest (don’t disagree with me on the last two points). Wakasa being the most talented at hackingu spent more than 10 years and she barely scartched the surface the Bo. The word "hackingu" is a vague term. It doesn't mean that she had access to everything the bo wants to hide, only a few of them. How did she get those? We don't know so we can just speculate, and like Aoyama once said in an interview when asked about how did Amuro join the Bo; she must have done it in very skilful way. Hacking a new phone that a member once used to eavesdrop on their phone calls before getting rid of it or hacking a member's laptop and copying some of his digital data before he notices it can accumulate her knowledge.
We don’t know her background so we can't compare her yet with government agencies. These agencies usually put bounties on people on their blacklist because they know that normal individuals sometimes can find their way to their goals.

Kanenori Wakita turned out to be Rum, so odds are Gosho isn't going for the surprise factor, here—he's likely going for the reveal you see coming. Reveals you're meant to see coming (that are meant to be obvious), and reveals that are meant to be surprising (that are not meant to be obvious)—neither one is good or bad on its own, after all... either one can be satisfying or disappointing.

No worries, I didn't take it that way.

If Gosho does make Rumi a true third party, then I look forward to seeing how Gosho does it.

The Rum reveal was saved by the fact that Wakita was the old man from the warehouse, and I liked the reveal.
Gosho will find his way to make the Wakasa reveal entertaining and I am definitely going to enjoy it even if Wakasa= Asaka, but I only want a twist.

[DCUniverseAficionado]

So you're saying she didn't need a BO member to give the list to her, because she just hacked the BO and got the info all by herself?
My problem with that is if she pulled that off by herself, there's nothing stopping the government agencies from hacking the BO themselves with legions of hackers, and uncovering every piece of digital info the BO has. Basically, the government agencies can get a huge victory by just hacking the BO.
Even Shūichi/Subaru is clearly capable of hacking (see Mystery Train), so why hasn't he just hacked in and taken all the BO's info?

Gosho made some characters and gave them incredible talents. Akai is the best at sniping, Makoto is the strongest, Kobayashi is the cutest and Yusaku is the smartest (don’t disagree with me on the last two points). Wakasa being the most talented at hackingu spent more than 10 years and she barely scartched the surface the Bo. The word "hackingu" is a vague term. It doesn't mean that she had access to everything the bo wants to hide, only a few of them.

How did she get those? We don't know so we can just speculate, and like Aoyama once said in an interview when asked about how did Amuro join the Bo; she must have done it in very skilful way.

We don’t know her background so we can't compare her yet with government agencies. These agencies usually put bounties on people on their blacklist because they know that normal individuals sometimes can find their way to their goals.

Where are the hints that she, of all people, is good at hacking? With Shūichi/Subaru, there's at least the Mystery Train instance of him doing so.

Until more details are provided, that's a bit too easy for me to go with.

If just one individual can access info from the project the BO deems its most important, I think multiple hackers employed by the government agencies would have a field day... I doubt the BO's security is slipshod enough for just one user to obtain such vital info.

[HatiMMOS]

Where are the hints that she, of all people, is good at hacking? With Shūichi/Subaru, there's at least the Mystery Train instance of him doing so.

If just one individual can access info from the project the BO deems its most important, I think multiple hackers employed by the government agencies would have a field day... I doubt the BO's security is slipshod enough for just one user to obtain such vital info.

Yeah, you are taking the easy and safe way based on what we know from the manga while I take a step further then that and base my thoughts on hypotheses like that she good at hacking, the risky way. It is normal that your thought looks more appealing to everyone than mine -because mine is an extension of a theory.

Until more details are provided, that's a bit too easy for me to go with.

Yeah ofc. Just to remind that I myself don't clench to everything I write. I consider of them as "possibilities" rather than my actual thoughts.
So what are my actual thoughts on Wakasa ? I don't know yet XD because we can't be sure yet of anything, the potential hints don't pinpoint her affiliation, and her being a Bo member is not the only option.

[blackmoon]

So you're saying she didn't need a BO member to give the list to her, because she just hacked the BO and got the info all by herself?
My problem with that is if she pulled that off by herself, there's nothing stopping the government agencies from hacking the BO themselves with legions of hackers, and uncovering every piece of digital info the BO has. Basically, the government agencies can get a huge victory by just hacking the BO.
Even Shūichi/Subaru is clearly capable of hacking (see Mystery Train), so why hasn't he just hacked in and taken all the BO's info?

Gosho made some characters and gave them incredible talents. Akai is the best at sniping, Makoto is the strongest, Kobayashi is the cutest and Yusaku is the smartest (don’t disagree with me on the last two points). Wakasa being the most talented at hackingu spent more than 10 years and she barely scartched the surface the Bo. The word "hackingu" is a vague term. It doesn't mean that she had access to everything the bo wants to hide, only a few of them. How did she get those? We don't know so we can just speculate, and like Aoyama once said in an interview when asked about how did Amuro join the Bo; she must have done it in very skilful way. Hacking a new phone that a member once used to eavesdrop on their phone calls before getting rid of it or hacking a member's laptop and copying some of his digital data before he notices it can accumulate her knowledge.
We don’t know her background so we can't compare her yet with government agencies. These agencies usually put bounties on people on their blacklist because they know that normal individuals sometimes can find their way to their goals.

Well if Wakasa indeed is gifted with such amazing hacking talent that even professor Agasa the amazing inventor was unable to overcome the nightbaron virus then that would truly be amazing. Not to mention the amazing night vision and one-kick martial arts in knocking our Bourbon... ah... that would be a talent so unfair to all others.

But then again... like i mentioned before I find it rather odd that she wasn't even a bit surprised when Conan used his needle-watch gadget. Whatever her identity or background... be it a spy, detective, or criminal... wouldn't it be strange not to be surprised when seeing a kid possessing and using such gadget? It's almost as if she wasn't a bit surprised.. as if she had seen it before or perhaps have prior knowledge about Conan having such a thing? I mean like Mary wasn't surprised because she recalled meeting the "wizard" before from the beach event yet when and where did RUMI met Conan?

[Mohamed Ebrahem]

I have some old ideas about Wakasa that I think haven't been denied yet :

Wakasa is like Curaçao ,,, Rum wanted to take advantage of Curaçao's unique skills and make her subordinate to him ,, Also Karasuma wanted Wakasa to work as his subordinate because he saw her strength , intelligence , strong hearing .... etc .

Curaçao betrayed the organization and ran away from them and knew the truth of Sherry ,,, also Wakasa betrayed the organization , ran away from them after Kohji case , and she knew the truth of Sherry , so Wakasa is a former member of the organization and was subordinated to Carasuma personally .

Wakasa belongs to Haibara's family through Atsushi , she may be his sister or (niece/daughter of his Brother) .

Wakasa is Asaka the bodyguard, and she may have killed Amanda while Rum killed Kohji ,,,, i think Wakasa was a bad person and a criminal while she was in BO , but Kohji case has made her change like Curaçao did when she met the Detective Boys .

Wakasa is supergirl , who lacks flying and taking fire out of her eyes .

The poison that Elena made disappears after killing the victim , This poison killed Kohji , Wakasa's love . While Haibara's poison makes the victim disappear , but the effect of the poison suddenly stopped in Conan and Haibara's body .

- How did Wakasa get the APTX list ? I have 2 possibilities :

1- May have she got it from Haibara because the list is very recent and contains the name Shinchi .... Honestly, I don’t know what surprised Wakasa in file 1070 !! . Is she surprised that Haibara didn't tell her the truth that she is Shiho herself, or was she surprised by something new that she knew after hearing Conan’s words with Haibara , but it seems that Haibara knows identity of Wakasa very well , while Wakasa may not know some facts about the child Haibara . I think there was a conversation between Wakasa and Haibara after the golf player case when Wakasa drove the detective boys to home .

2- or Rumi may still be in communication with a BO member and got the list from him .

- Why did BO not move against Wakasa after she appeared in the newspapers ?

1- she ran away 17 years ago , and we do not know who the members of the organization were at that time .

2- Wakasa may have faked her death, so they did not expect that she is still alive after all that time of disappearance and she will join an elementary school . Also her face may have changed completely after all this time . The organization hasn't moved against Conan, Haibara or Akai because they believe they are dead .

3- BO may have already moved against Wakasa to make sure whether she is Asaka or not , but Gosho will not show this scene to us because we would know that Wakasa is not Rum or a BO member ,,, so the organization may have broken into Wakasa apartment in her absence and searched for The shogi piece in that apartment because it will be actual proof that Rumi and Asaka are the same person ,,, I think Wakasa hid the piece in her back pocket because no one would expect to hide it in her pocket instead of putting it in a safe place like her flat ..... In the 20th movie , Conan and Haibara identify Curaçao's corpse through the little toy she had.

[DCUniverseAficionado]

Yeah, you are taking the easy and safe way based on what we know from the manga while I take a step further then that and base my thoughts on hypotheses like that she good at hacking, the risky way. It is normal that your thought looks more appealing to everyone than mine -because mine is an extension of a theory.

Just to remind that I myself don't clench to everything I write. I consider of them as "possibilities" rather than my actual thoughts.
So what are my actual thoughts on Wakasa ? I don't know yet XD because we can't be sure yet of anything, the potential hints don't pinpoint her affiliation, and her being a Bo member is not the only option.

Yep, possibilities and probabilities. Possibilities allow for anything, no matter how "risky", to be on the table, whereas probabilities are more safe/based/grounded.
If we're talking probabilities, then I'd say Rumi has the APTX list, and is not being targeted by the BO for making a public display, because she's currently in the BO.
But if we're talking possibilities, then sure, in addition to being a formidable close-range fighter, Rumi (whether she's a true third party or is backed by a government agency) could also be a pro at digital information gathering, to the point of being able to hack her way into getting the APTX list. I try to keep possibilities like that in mind—to not "clench" to things with ironclad certainty—so I don't get blindsided when what I think is a probability doesn't happen. That's why I was open to, for example, the Chikara Katsumata = Rum and Muga Iori = Rum theories.

[Reader]

So, this case will be interesting in many ways, or atleast it looks that way. First of all, the hint of looming danger over Shiho. Since it has been brought up, we can expect some BO thing at the end of this file. Or something along those lines. Next is the capsule. Conan's aim to keep the message a secret once found is far fetched considering Wakasa is around. Will she be a hindrance? And what about the ordering sushi part? And also the references to Kuminaga and the mysterious 200 or 300 faced man? And why are those three so shocked on seeing just a piece of code? What lies in the capsule exactly? What is the message a 12 yr old Akemi wished to tell her sister?
*Stay tuned* (laughs)

[HatiMMOS]

But then again... like I mentioned before I find it rather odd that she wasn't even a bit surprised when Conan used his needle-watch gadget. Whatever her identity or background... be it a spy, detective, or criminal... wouldn't it be strange not to be surprised when seeing a kid possessing and using such gadget? It's almost as if she wasn't a bit surprised.. as if she had seen it before or perhaps have prior knowledge about Conan having such a thing? I mean like Mary wasn't surprised because she recalled meeting the "wizard" before from the beach event yet when and where did RUMI met Conan?

Yeah, she wasn't surprised as if she either had prior knowledge about Conan or she is a tech-maniac, . I was tempted to say that since we have these 007 references, their shouId be character equivalent to the MI6's Q. I first suspected Mary for being a part of the tech research facility inside the MI6 but her athleticism and her personality in general says the opposite thing. Wakasa's past is so mysterious that I don't know how to link her with the MI6. Though I'm thinking that she is the "demon in the darkness". We have the cute evil duo, Kobayashi and Wakasa; the oni-baba and the demon of the darkness. She only fights her enemies in dark places, no one sees her, and this goes in the way of her being a third party member now and why Rum didn't recognize her face even though there is a very high possibility that they clashed in the hotel 17 years ago. How does Mary know about this demon before ? WeII, we saw the Akai famiIy copying Tsutomu, so Tsutomu must have encountred Wakasa because they were both investigating the same case and she probabIy kicked his ass too XD.
And if your asking about how she managed to corner Rum/Bo members in a dark place in a hoteI, she couId have made a blackout that gave her some minutes before they can use their secondary eIectricity suppIies.( and that's how she electrocuted her husband ?)
And how did she get those gadgets at the time ? I don't know, she can't be the one who made those, and I'm not confident about aII of this.

Wakasa is Asaka the bodyguard, and she may have killed Amanda while Rum killed Kohji

This one is good.

1- May have she got it from Haibara because the list is very recent and contains the name Shinchi .... Honestly, I don’t know what surprised Wakasa in file 1070 !! . Is she surprised that Haibara didn't tell her the truth that she is Shiho herself, or was she surprised by something new that she knew after hearing Conan’s words with Haibara , but it seems that Haibara knows identity of Wakasa very well , while Wakasa may not know some facts about the child Haibara . I think there was a conversation between Wakasa and Haibara after the golf player case when Wakasa drove the detective boys to home .

I don't think so

2- or Rumi may still be in communication with a BO member and got the list from him .

- Why did BO not move against Wakasa after she appeared in the newspapers ?

1- she ran away 17 years ago , and we do not know who the members of the organization were at that time.

2- Wakasa may have faked her death, so they did not expect that she is still alive after all that time of disappearance and she will join an elementary school . Also her face may have changed completely after all this time . The organization hasn't moved against Conan, Haibara or Akai because they believe they are dead .

Nahh

3- BO may have already moved against Wakasa to make sure whether she is Asaka or not , but Gosho will not show this scene to us because we would know that Wakasa is not Rum or a BO member ,,, so the organization may have broken into Wakasa apartment in her absence and searched for The shogi piece in that apartment because it will be actual proof that Rumi and Asaka are the same person ,,, I think Wakasa hid the piece in her back pocket because no one would expect to hide it in her pocket instead of putting it in a safe place like her flat ..... In the 20th movie , Conan and Haibara identify Curaçao's corpse through the little toy she had.

But her not trying to run or to hide means that she is confident that she is not in danger

Yep, possibilities and probabilities. Possibilities allow for anything, no matter how "risky", to be on the table, whereas probabilities are more safe/based/grounded.
If we're talking probabilities, then I'd say Rumi has the APTX list, and is not being targeted by the BO for making a public display, because she's currently in the BO.
But if we're talking possibilities, then sure, in addition to being a formidable close-range fighter, Rumi (whether she's a true third party or is backed by a government agency) could also be a pro at digital information gathering, to the point of being able to hack her way into getting the APTX list. I try to keep possibilities like that in mind—to not "clench" to things with ironclad certainty—so I don't get blindsided when what I think is a probability doesn't happen. That's why I was open to, for example, the Chikara Katsumata = Rum and Muga Iori = Rum theories.

Nice.

Btw, your name "DCUniverseAficionado" is l0ng xD, give us a nickname.

Since it has been brought up, we can expect some BO thing at the end of this file. Or something along those lines.

I'm looking forward to that.

Next is the capsule. Conan's aim to keep the message a secret once found is far fetched considering Wakasa is around. Will she be a hindrance?

Sure, she wants it.
Fans already cracked the code.

Spoiler:

The cipher shoud be easy for someone who always uses keyboards and laptops.

And also the references to Kuminaga and the mysterious 200 or 300 faced man? And why are those three so shocked on seeing just a piece of code? What lies in the capsule exactly? What is the message a 12 yr old Akemi wished to tell her sister?
*Stay tuned* (laughs)

[Mohamed Ebrahem]

But her not trying to run or to hide means that she is confident that she is not in danger

After episode of Haido Hotel 178 ,, Conan said to Haibara "I don't think BO will search for you in this city anymore because they expect you will flee to another place" . So the same logic here , no one expects that Asaka will return again after all this time . Conan after episode 425 did not agree to the presence of an FBI escort for Mouri Kogoro because BO will know there is no relationship between Kogoro and FBI , so if Wakasa shows that she is cautious or afraid of something , anyone who watches her from the organization will know that Wakasa is Asaka . therefore , it is best for her to let her guard down and live as a normal person .

I forgot to mention some thoughts in the previous post :

- Wakasa is the one who made the mirror message "Karasuma" , not Haneda Koji .... I'm sure of that point .

- Wakasa was locked in the bathroom for a while, I am not sure if it was she who closed herself or RUM forced her to do , but I think she made the mirror message at that time ... There is an episode of Arc Bourbon alluding to that point where there was a girl named Waka and Her sister is Rumi if i remember well , "Waka" fainted in the bathroom and Ran fell on her . I don't remember the episode number .

- Wakasa is not with any team at the moment , but she hates BO in general and hates Carasuma in particular .

- Rum succeeded in making the accusation of killing Kohji to Asaka the fugitive .

[HatiMMOS]

After episode of Haido Hotel 178 ,, Conan said to Haibara "I don't think BO will search for you in this city anymore because they expect you will flee to another place" . So the same logic here , no one expects that Asaka will return again after all this time . Conan after episode 425 did not agree to the presence of an FBI escort for Mouri Kogoro because BO will know there is no relationship between Kogoro and FBI , so if Wakasa shows that she is cautious or afraid of something , anyone who watches her from the organization will know that Wakasa is Asaka . therefore , it is best for her to let her guard down and live as a normal person .

That's two different things. Haibara and Cone didn't make any move because the Bo doesn't know their current appearances so it can't find them which is not the case for Wakasa.

[DCUniverseAficionado]

1,071 spoiler pics are out.

Spoiler:

Rum/Kanenori is headed for Teitan Elementary.

Case will conclude in 1,072.

[HatiMMOS]

1,071 spoiler pics are out.

Spoiler:

Rum/Kanenori is headed for Teitan Elementary.

Case will conclude in 1,072.

I don't like that as their first encounter in the manga. The Bo's second in command while doing a sushi delivery, met one of the most skilled agents in the world in a tracksuit in an elementary school, doesn't sound great to me. It's good that we will witness their first interaction, but it coud have been handed differently from Gosho.(That if they will interact in the first place)

Akemi's past, Haibara, Wakasa and Kobayashi, Conan and maybe Wakita ! it is very exciting to see what will come out out of that

[blackmoon]

1,071 spoiler pics are out.

Spoiler:

Rum/Kanenori is headed for Teitan Elementary.

Case will conclude in 1,072.

I'm pretty sure that he's just after that missing shogi piece he was interested in after hearing a report from Bourbon showing the photo of 2 beautiful ladies on the bus... Either that.... or he's just delivering sushi ordered by the 3 hungry post-graduates. Surely the oldman couldn't actually be interested in Sherry? That would make a good cocktail?!

"I’ve experimented by adding a Sherry twist to classic cocktail recipes and one fine result is the Sherry Mojito — traditionally made with white and dark rum. For the drink, a dry Fino Sherry is used". --Cedric Gerard, bar manager at Duende in Western Australia has been educated in the versatility of Sherry Wine and loves it.