Ran's role changed? Other's too?

[Misztina]

This topic came to my mind again, when Nyarl brought it up yesteday. Actually there've been discussion on this years ago too, there Shinxela made her points in this topic, so I may use their thoughts too unconsciously. ^^""

Ran Mouri/Mouri Ran... who is she? If you asked that question before the 42nd or the 49th volume we would have said, she is the main female character, Shinichi's love interest and so on, etc.

But after it... after nearly 14 volumes she has lost her title. There were of course major issues during these last volumes, let's not forget that she was a sort of a link between Conan and Eisuke, in addition there was the Shirigama(or what) case, which was about her, but...

Her characters became plain. She is the good-hearted, naive girl, who can sometimes kick some a** if she shows up. She seemes to become a dream-like girl, an aim to Shinichi to reach and not an active character.

Of course now I thought, after she met Okiya that there might be a possibility for her to become something...but again (I may be very impatient) when was her last suspicion about him at all? And will it ever lead to somewhere? (Probably yes, but...)

Clearly DC is a shounen manga, but the before and after Halloween cases and female roles differ. Even Ai has a weirder role than she used to have.

I miss somehow the feelings of the pre-Halloween files, where the supposedly main characters had important roles. One more criticism, of course the Detective Boys have to be everywhere, if they continue like that, they'll beat the BO.

In the end, I have to tell, that I still love DC, I still like the story, I just thought this thought might bring a good and interesting discussion. ^^

[Nyarl]

It would be nice if we learned something actually changed from her POV of the relationship during the Shiragami story, like she thinks Shin'ichi is concealing a terminal illness from her or something. Her thoughts are rarely developed as part of the continuity, which makes her seem  oblivious to things she's seen and heard, or like a character that doesn't actually have continuity outside of a particular story. This didn't seem as true when she was making pottery to tell Shin'ichi that she'd be waiting for him, or when she was showing repeated signs that she was suspicious of Conan (though, the latter is probably easily overlooked if one doesn't read volume 25&26 before volumes 14-24... Aoyama's propensity to keep thoughts hidden for later surprises is probably the main reason the characters often seem poorly developed or unaware of the continuity developing around them, I suppose).

It's also been a while since she's done anything useful with her karate, basically she's just threatened/hurt innocents with it. That's not new, but doesn't seem as funny when the manga doesn't have a slapstick tone, and it hasn't been balanced with heroic use recently.

[GinRei]

She'll probably be captured by Bourbon sometime within the next few months.  How else is he supposed to have a showdown with Conan?  (I know there's many ways it could work, but this way makes use of the pills.)

[chubs191]

DC has such a huge, growing cast that it's hard to fit them all in and give them good roles.  Like what was stated, Ran had a good role and at the same time was very active in the early stages of the story; but as time goes by and more characters get added, some get left out. 


I think that's where Gosho fails in his story line.  He should stick to a dozen or so repeating characters, but when you try to stick all of them in there at once the storyline declines in quality.  A good example of this is movie 10.

Also he can't kill off any of his character line, with the exception of one.  He should really start killing people off or write them out.  This is probably the only way he can clear up his story line a little bit more and stay focused.

[Jd-]

The problems with movie 10 were endless--poor writing, poor pacing, poor production design, etc etc etc... None of which were Gosho's fault. Blame the terribleness of that movie on the film production team (I like to blame the director, myself), as they're the ones who made it from start to finish--and the ones who insisted on putting in a lot of unnecessary characters that couldn't produce a coherent storyline together if they tried. Gosho likely only signed off on it once for the contract, and that was that.

[chubs191]

The problems with movie 10 were endless--poor writing, poor pacing, poor production design, etc etc etc... None of which were Gosho's fault. Blame the terribleness of that movie on the film production team (I like to blame the director, myself), as they're the ones who made it from start to finish--and the ones who insisted on putting in a lot of unnecessary characters that couldn't produce a coherent storyline together if they tried. Gosho likely only signed off on it once for the contract, and that was that.

Sorry if I didn't state it clear enough, Jd, but I wasn't saying it was Gosho's fault.  I was saying that it's the result of trying to fit too many characters into a story at once, just to keep the conversation DC centered.

[GinRei]

The problem isn't so much that there's too many characters.  Most of the characters don't interact at the same time due to plot reasons. 

• You rarely see FBI and any other characters together anymore, because now they're "The FBI" rather than "mysterious characters". 
• The Police trust Conan for the most part now, so there's no reason for him to need someone to relay his clues through.
• Heiji and Kazuha are almost always together now, and when they're around so is Ran.  Rarely happens at the same time as any other "group" interaction.
• When the Detective Boys are around, either Agasa, Yukiko, or the Police are around.
• Sonoko basically only pops up when they want to have her swoon over someone, or give Ran someone to talk to without having Kazuha and Heiji there.
• Kogoro is the defacto character.  If no other "group" interaction is available, he's a central character.  Otherwise he basically just says a comment every now and then.
• Ran is in a similar boat to Kogoro.  However, it's at the point in the story where Conan is so close to the Black Organization, that if she gets too close she'd be in serious trouble.

Like I said before, Ran will likely soon be captured by Bourbon for the Conan vs Bourbon showdown.  That's when she'll become integral to the story again.

[Misztina]

Well, of course I don't expect e.g. Jodie to play a major role now, obviously she had her time and she is now not so interesting and I don't mind these group-changings, what GinRei wrote.

I have somehow this feeling that even if Ran gets into center position (not in soccer XD;;) her character might stay a bit flat as how it is now. Because, I accept the fact that she cannot take a big role in everything, it was okay that she didn't appeared in FBI-BO showdown at all, but in my opinion even if she has less roles, she could show some "interesting" things from her, not only the usual: "I'm nice, but kick ass if it's needed". A character doesn't have to play a major role in the plot to show something.

But I really hope that by the Conan-Bourbon or BO encounter and Ran will have moments when she can show more of her character. ^^

[Nyarl]

{...}

Like I said before, Ran will likely soon be captured by Bourbon for the Conan vs Bourbon showdown.  That's when she'll become integral to the story again.

I still think Ran's ultimate role will be the victim of Shin'ichi's hubris. If Bourbon "kidnaps" her, I'd expect her to be given APTX and/or locked in a burning building (due to some name puns (ranshi) and that bit about an arsonist bourbon drinker).

If she's "rescued", I'd wager that she'll really be Vermouth in disguise looking for her final escape from the Org. Vermouth had plenty of time to learn Ran's personality and habits while associated with the high school, and that seems to be a likely reason that she (links possible spoilers for volume 45 and 33) waited so long to finally make a move on Sherry. (Looks like clear foreshadowing of something like that to me...)

I just hope Aoyama doesn't make Ran so pointless and unlikable before then that people are cheering that plot twist rather than seeing it as sad and tragic.

[SkyVenger]

The problem isn't so much that there's too many characters.  Most of the characters don't interact at the same time due to plot reasons. 

• You rarely see FBI and any other characters together anymore, because now they're "The FBI" rather than "mysterious characters". 
• The Police trust Conan for the most part now, so there's no reason for him to need someone to relay his clues through.
• Heiji and Kazuha are almost always together now, and when they're around so is Ran.  Rarely happens at the same time as any other "group" interaction.
• When the Detective Boys are around, either Agasa, Yukiko, or the Police are around.
• Sonoko basically only pops up when they want to have her swoon over someone, or give Ran someone to talk to without having Kazuha and Heiji there.
• Kogoro is the defacto character.  If no other "group" interaction is available, he's a central character.  Otherwise he basically just says a comment every now and then.
• Ran is in a similar boat to Kogoro.  However, it's at the point in the story where Conan is so close to the Black Organization, that if she gets too close she'd be in serious trouble.

Like I said before, Ran will likely soon be captured by Bourbon for the Conan vs Bourbon showdown.  That's when she'll become integral to the story again.

There's also Eri during some other kinds of cases involving the law and Yusaku... well, he seems to be out of it
It's just that they were meant to be recurring characters that's why there's really no mixed interactions whatsoever within other groups. Try mixing Kid w/the BO

[GinRei]

Bah, forgot Eri!  Knew I forgot someone.  She's pretty rare though.

Try mixing Kid w/the BO

Read the Magical Kaitou Manga. 

[SkyVenger]

Try mixing Kid w/the BO

Read the Magical Kaitou Manga.   :P

Yeah, I hope the org in MK is related to BO
They aren't... for now

[sdf1macross]

I guess since we all know that Ran is the girl that will wait for Shinichi forever, there isn't much more that can be done as far as character development goes until Shinichi comes back for good or for a few days like he did in the Revival Arc.
The writers might feel that we know all there is to know about her and until Shinichi comes back or until she has some doubts about Conan's Identity again they will not work on Ran too much.
But of course this is just an opinion and I might be way off. 

[Misztina]

If she's "rescued", I'd wager that she'll really be Vermouth in disguise looking for her final escape from the Org. Vermouth had plenty of time to learn Ran's personality and habits while associated with the high school, and that seems to be a likely reason that she (links possible spoilers for volume 45 and 33) waited so long to finally make a move on Sherry. (Looks like clear foreshadowing of something like that to me...)

Actually this makes more sense than it seems to have. (that's a compliment ^^"") I don't think that the impersonation took part until now, because of the remark of Ran in the recent case, when she wanted to bathe with Conan together. I don't think that Vermouth could have had an access to such a "memory".

But, as for Vermouth's weird personality, she might impersonate Ran to "gain" her innocence that she lacks or she already knows that she will be in danger and by that time she will switch with her, protect her, offer her life or whatever.

But before that we will have a Bourbon encounter, and Ran, just like in HP (no, not Harry Potter ), will pop up and probably gets into deep trouble. She is either noticed by a real, bad-guy BO member or...well I can't think of other options now. ^^"

Her behaviour in the Bourbon-case gotta be important.

[Rellik]

then wat else does HP stands for? hairy ppl? lol