DCTP Forums

This is a topic for sharing any thoughts or observations you've had about Conan over the years, whether there be general, series-wide thoughts or case specific ones.

Some I've thought of:

(Series-wide)
Outside of one reference to Eri's father, I can't recall if any of either Shinichi or Ran's grandparents have ever been mentioned in the series, or if they're even alive.
Should I found it optimistic or disturbing that at least 3 times in the manga, in cases where the victim didn't die from the culprit's actions, they either wanted the charges against their would-be killers dropped if not let off the hook all together?
For all the times where people involved in cases get shocked when Kogoro announces who he is, there have been very few times where they were able to recognize who he was just by his voice or appearence first.

(Case-specific) At least in the manga cases, I find it refreshing how that in the Ramen Ogura case, early on it's mentioned in passing how someone died recently, and the killer's motive ultimately has nothing to do with this.

What about you guys?

I didn't like how Won't Forgive Even One Millimeter was handled. It was disturbing and potentially dangerous :/

cchanged wrote:I didn't like how Won't Forgive Even One Millimeter was handled. It was disturbing and potentially dangerous :/

How would you have written it?

DCUniverseAficionado wrote:

cchanged wrote:I didn't like how Won't Forgive Even One Millimeter was handled. It was disturbing and potentially dangerous :/

How would you have written it?

I wouldn't have rewritten it since Gosho is set on the simplistic and idealistic morals, which is understandable to a degree considering that Conan is a Shonen manga (and also I am uncreative ). I find this particular case and Ran Pulling Curtain to Block Police Sniper case going overboard with this idealism, however. Who is to say that the husband won't have a second offense, seeing how he has such a low tolerance to marital conflicts and a low threshold to cross over and actually attempt a premeditated murder. If I were the wife, I would be deeply disturbed and afraid for my life. The husband didn't act out of the heat of passion in the middle of a conflict; he acted out of deliberation.

cchanged wrote:(and also I am uncreative ).

As am I. Though I would also add inexperience to my shortcomings, in terms of writing fiction.

cchanged wrote:I find... Ran Pulling Curtain to Block Police Sniper case going overboard with this idealism, however.

Like it or not, that's part of Ran's character. She and Shinichi will try to save those that some would say don't deserve to be saved. That's not Gosho going overboard—who knows if he'd do that in real life, if such a situation came up—that's Ran's character being interpreted as a naive, blind idealist by those of a more consequentialist/utilitarian bent... though even this comparison may be too simplistic, on my part.

cchanged wrote:Who is to say that the husband won't have a second offense, seeing how he has such a low tolerance to marital conflicts and a low threshold to cross over and actually attempt a premeditated murder. If I were the wife, I would be deeply disturbed and afraid for my life. The husband didn't act out of the heat of passion in the middle of a conflict; he acted out of deliberation.

We don't know if he would or if he wouldn't—he and his wife are one-case characters. In terms of plot, that case was to show Shiho's/Ai's thoughts about Shuichi's/Subaru's words in the previous case (Detectives' Nocturne) and to show that Scar Akai (Bourbon) was back, nearly 100 files since his last appearance. They were there to have a case and mystery that Shinichi/Conan could solve.

The husband knows how horrible he'd been, and was, in that moment of ultimate moral failure. People like that have the potential—not an ironclad guarantee, of course—to use that knowledge to make sure they never do such a thing again. Besides, if the wife (or Shinichi/Conan for that matter) had accused him of deliberate murder, then their baby would've been without a father (Shinichi's/Conan's main reason for not accusing him), and who knows what would've happened to him once he got out of prison? Would he have gone on to have a similar situation with another woman? Would he have used his experience to make sure he never did such a thing, again? What if his wife's forgiveness and having to raise a child was the only thing that could change him? We can't know.

People like this husband will get focused on for making their spouse worse off—in this case, the focus at the end seemed to be how this wife made their spouse better off. Such a forgiving and open heart may be the only way to save such a person from themselves, and even save everyone else from them... at least, that's the mindset of those who are capable of being so forgiving, capable of such sacrifice, and who are capable of taking such risks.

DCUniverseAficionado wrote:

cchanged wrote: I find... Ran Pulling Curtain to Block Police Sniper case going overboard with this idealism, however.

Like it or not, that's part of Ran's character. She and Shinichi will try to save those that some would say don't deserve to be saved. That's not Gosho going overboard—who knows if he'd do that in real life, if such a situation came up—that's Ran's character being interpreted as a naive, blind idealist by those of a more consequentialist/utilitarian bent... though even this comparison may be too simplistic, on my part.

I maintain that Gosho went overboard on this one and perhaps unintentionally undermined Ran's character (it certainly did in my view). This is not merely a question of who deserves to be saved. By pulling the curtain, Ran essentially made the life-death decision to forsake an alternate route of rescue for everyone present based solely on her blind confidence in and shared morals with Shinichi. This was selfish of her. Also, Ran could very well have been charged with obstructing a law enforcement officer. You could argue that Ran's action should only be interpreted symbolically, whatever. Though let me reiterate my view that Ran's action actually undermines Ran's selflessness, an integral part of Ran's character.

DCUniverseAficionado wrote:

cchanged wrote:Who is to say that the husband won't have a second offense, seeing how he has such a low tolerance to marital conflicts and a low threshold to cross over and actually attempt a premeditated murder. If I were the wife, I would be deeply disturbed and afraid for my life. The husband didn't act out of the heat of passion in the middle of a conflict; he acted out of deliberation.

We don't know if he would or if he wouldn't—he and his wife are one-case characters. In terms of plot, that case was to show Shiho's/Ai's thoughts about Shuichi's/Subaru's words in the previous case (Detectives' Nocturne) and to show that Scar Akai (Bourbon) was back, nearly 100 files since his last appearance. They were there to have a case and mystery that Shinichi/Conan could solve.

The husband knows how horrible he'd been, and was, in that moment of ultimate moral failure. People like that have the potential—not an ironclad guarantee, of course—to use that knowledge to make sure they never do such a thing again. Besides, if the wife (or Shinichi/Conan for that matter) had accused him of deliberate murder, then their baby would've been without a father (Shinichi's/Conan's main reason for not accusing him), and who knows what would've happened to him once he got out of prison? Would he have gone on to have a similar situation with another woman? Would he have used his experience to make sure he never did such a thing, again? What if his wife's forgiveness and having to raise a child was the only thing that could change him? We can't know.

People like this husband will get focused on for making their spouse worse off—in this case, the focus at the end seemed to be how this wife made their spouse better off. Such a forgiving and open heart may be the only way to save such a person from themselves, and even save everyone else from them... at least, that's the mindset of those who are capable of being so forgiving, capable of such sacrifice, and who are capable of taking such risks.

No father would be better than a murderous father, I assume. You know what I think the husband needs? He needs some psychological counseling I don't think a mentally healthy person would jump from marital conflicts (which were not even bordering on life-threatening in their case) to plotting murder of one's spouse. Especially in a series like Conan, which has the recurring theme that there is no reason to take another's life (well, save for self-defense), I thought it absurd that Conan let him off like that. But I concede that since the wife decided to forgive her husband anyway, it might ultimately be better for the couple to have settled the matter themselves.

cchanged wrote:I maintain that Gosho went overboard on this one and perhaps unintentionally undermined Ran's character (it certainly did in my view). This is not merely a question of who deserves to be saved. By pulling the curtain, Ran essentially made the life-death decision to forsake an alternate route of rescue for everyone present based solely on her blind confidence in and shared morals with Shinichi. This was selfish of her. Also, Ran could very well have been charged with obstructing a law enforcement officer. You could argue that Ran's action should only be interpreted symbolically, whatever. Though let me reiterate my view that Ran's action actually undermines Ran's selflessness, an integral part of Ran's character.

So you are of the view that what Masumi did to get the bomber in a position where he could be taken out by police snipers should not have been intervened with? That the bomber should've been shot and killed? Or do you think there was a third way?

The way the situation ultimately ended, if Ran hadn't stepped in when she did, there would've been one death instead of none. The minute Ran stepped in, everyone was saved—from an out-of-universe perspective, at least—because the only alternative to Shinichi tricking the bomber into submission, at that point, and the standoff ending that way, would be for Ran, Kogoro, Masumi, the three suspects, the bomber, and even the riot police outside the door, to die in a fiery explosion. Killing off Ran, Kogoro and Masumi? Out of the question. Also, shooting a hostage taker in the head is the last resort. Given that, at the point when Masumi tried to have the bomber sniped, Shinichi/Conan hadn't tried to trick the bomber into thinking his sister had killed herself, all the options weren't yet exhausted.

If Shinichi/Conan was there, in person, he would've taken action to stop what Masumi was doing. If Kogoro was smarter, he would've done the same. Thus, in specifically crafted scenarios where death of a single antagonistic individual is the only way to save everyone around that individual, the desire of all three of these characters to prevent violent death can become a flaw, which can be interpreted as naive, or even interpreted as putting pure ethical egoism on full display. However, this scenario (File 771–File 774/Episode 648–Episode 650) was not one of them.

cchanged wrote:You know what I think the husband needs? He needs some psychological counseling

Yeah... I apologize for not thinking of that. And the DBs would need some, too.