Kor wrote:Chekhov MacGuffin wrote:
Yes we all know this arc had pacing issues and it was easy for all you smart adults to figure out the plot of a manga meant for children and teens which took the fun out of it, but damn I am tired of hearing people whine about how Detective Conan has gone downhill, the new characters suck, etc. It's like people who circlejerk about "Justin Bieber/Twilight" hate. 1-2 years of whining later and I am ready for everyone to stuff a sock in it and move on already.
For better or worse, that's what you'll get out of a fandom
Yeah, I know it's to be expected, but still the DC fandom is a lot higher quality than most other fandoms. I know the people can be exceptional, so it is sad when it collectively gets caught on a particular rut of whining.
Kor wrote:
(though out of curiosity, do you feel that attitude mainly from here, DCW, or both?).
It seems to have some connection to DCTP's culture I feel. At DCW, there has been some problems with people complaining about the Bourbon arc at what I would call inopportune locations/times, but there is far less of it. Usually people focus on what they like with the tradeoff being the discussion isn't as deep as you would see here.
Maybe it's because DCW is more not American and younger on average? Vocalized disappointment with the Bourbon arc worked out of people's systems pretty quickly and more discussion started about the upcoming cases and some ramifications of what happened. It's a bit hard to compare because the post volume at DCW is a lot lower so discussion is over a lot longer time scales.
kkslider5552000 wrote:
...but no one has done that for a while. No one anyone pays attention to that I've seen at least.
Discussion interrupting-type whining is pretty common in the spoiler cbox which is a major hub of plot discussion these days, especially whenever someone brings up the mystery train, and it comes up with slightly less regularity in general and spoiler threads too. It's really annoying because sometimes I (and presumably others) want to talk about the technicalities of the new plot and characters without being derailed by people changing the subject to talking about not liking it or X character and hoping they get put on a bus. Because I talk plot a lot and follow plot discussions I see it "relatively often".
If you want to see this effect in action, go to the spoiler cbox next time a Kaitou Kid case rolls around. There are a few people discussing aspects of the case, but guaranteed someone will turn the discussion into not liking Kid and about how no one likes Kid cases in the spoiler cbox. It's true, I don't like Kid, but I like cases, and I want to talk about that, not the same Kid hate that comes up every time he does.
kkslider5552000 wrote:
Ok, first of all, you better not be talking about me because despite some increasing frustration at the series at points, I've been quite optimistic.
You contributed a little to the whining in this thread, but no, this was not aimed at you in particular. There's no one person to blame - it's a collective problem; one person starts the subject, then others get on board. That one person starting isn't always the same, nor are those who follow up. I've been part of the problem myself from time to time. Now though, I'm tired of the inevitable snarky comments about how X isn't good whenever X comes up. It's like the plot version of the derailing that used to happen whenever someone happened to mention Aicon or Shinran in an unrelated thread. I hope people would eventually move on.
If people want to make Things I dislike about the Bourbon arc and its characters thread, that would be excellent. I'd even post there. I just want it contained though.
kkslider5552000 wrote:
Second of all...there's a difference between being optimistic and just ignoring stuff. The biggest problem with any long running series, specifically ones consistently written by the same person, it is borderline impossible to keep up the same quality every single week (or month considering the average amount of chapters per case, plus the occasional breaks). Well, that and if you rely on formulas (which is often practically required), it will start to feel old, unless it gets even better. The fact that the quality is even comparable to its peak (at times equal to it even) is probably equally as impressive as how good it was when Gosho's ideas were still relatively fresh. That's my "theory" on the whole thing at least. Having this arc last as long as it has was still not a good idea, I stand by that.
This is a totally reasonable and well balanced opinion. I like it.
